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The morality of magic


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#41 aurora

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 10:18 AM

I understand the word selfish has negative connotations and when taken to an extreme can be quite unpleasant to encounter but...
 
 

 

 
 
What's wrong with being selfish?  I want what I want.  What's mine is mine.  I take care of my own.  My little corner of the world is the most important to me.  I just don't see a problem with it.

 
When it comes to taking care of our own how much regard do we really have for others? 
 
If that's selfish then I'm not embarrassed to claim that title.













Yep,ditto

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#42 RoseRed

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 12:58 PM

Yeah, what I wrote above and this:

 

 

As for 'morality,' well I've never been given reason to regret a curse or whatnot that I've done, only the ones I haven't performed seem to bite me in the ass. That's a moral for you. If you think you're taking the high road by allowing nasty, horrible people to walk around and continue to harm others, that's certainly...interesting. I just don't agree  ...   Just don't try to impose that particular moral structure on me or mine, and don't be surprised if I swing a full conniption if you do.

 

 

Except for Phoenix talking about his dog dying most of this thread has been about everyday stuff and taking care of our own.

 

I find that extreme situations and emotions are where we truly define our moral boundaries.  It's easy to talk about morals when we're not in a situation where we're about to cross those lines. 

 

But I also find myself giving serious thought to a lot of Michele's posts where she discusses our own personal responsibility in allowing certain situations to happen or continue.

 

Thanx for bumping these, J.  And the timing is perfect.  I have a day where I can sit with my own thoughts and these threads add a different perspective.


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#43 Roanna

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 01:21 PM

.

I find that extreme situations and emotions are where we truly define our moral boundaries.  It's easy to talk about morals when we're not in a situation where we're about to cross those lines. 

 

 

 

I can see what you are saying here but I don't believe that morality is derived entirely from experience. I don't believe I personally could come across an "extreme" situation that would cause me to act again the blueprint of my own personality and my own subjective morality. It's a bit like the argument (that someone tried on me the other day) - you'd believe in the death penalty if somebody close to you was brutally murdered. Well no, I wouldn't, the personal experience is irrelevant - I have fixed moral viewpoints on the matter and no amount of reactionary emotion will sway me from what is a personal moral imperative - my own definition of what I believe to be right and wrong. My personal  beliefs go beyond what I may or may not have experienced in my everyday life.

 

This incidentally is why I make the distinction between subjective and objective morality. It would be wrong for me to kill because I believe it to be an immoral act. It may well not be wrong for another witch to kill because he/she may not believe it to be an immoral act. The specifics of the act are irrelevant - we both believe we are doing the "right thing" - we are both of us acting in accord with our personal morality. I do not believe in this example either witch is more right/wrong than the other.

 

I don't think extreme situations shape morality, I think introspection into the self shapes morality. You don't look outward into the world and decide what you think to be right/wrong, you look inward to the self and understand your own values from within.


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#44 RoseRed

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Posted 24 March 2014 - 02:18 PM

Really good points to consider. 

 

That's what I'm doing right now.  Thank you.


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#45 moonthorn

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Posted 15 April 2014 - 07:01 AM

I followed this topic when it was heating up back in March & intended to reply. 

These responses are all so well-said that I am now reading it again & again before I do so.

I suppose it depends on what I am doing that it could be termed self-serving. As someone said above, "There's nothing wrong with trying to make one's life amazing" & "Who wouldn't want to defend their own, get what they want, etc.?".  

There's a lot more to explore, as my opinion on this subject isn't so fixed. What is moral to one may not be to another. 


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#46 Solanaceae

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Posted 04 November 2017 - 11:36 AM

Bump. Stumbled upon this thread while looking for another, thought it interesting and relevant and perhaps someone else will as well!


Edited by Solanaceae, 04 November 2017 - 01:50 PM.

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#47 Steriki

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Posted 05 November 2017 - 11:42 PM

Thanks for bumping it!I've recently been confronted with the idea that most of my work is extremely selfish. But along with so many interesting points made, it stood out to me that serving myself isn't necessarily an evil thing. Oh, morality such a fickle thing!
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#48 Tricycle

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Posted 06 November 2017 - 02:47 AM

I look at magic the same way I look at my hands. They're just hands. If I were to knock on your door, and you open it, I could do many things with my hands. I could hug you, punch you, shake your hand, pass you a gift, or keep them by my sides. It's not the fact that I'm using my hands that makes my actions in that moment selfish; they're just hands. It's my choices that determine whether or not I'm being selfish. To me, it's the same with magic.

 

And there are different degrees of selfishness, and in my mind, sometimes it's ok, and sometimes it's not. But I don't necessarily think helping yourself is selfish. I eat everyday to stay alive. But I don't think that is selfish. Do I constantly steal food from someone else so I can live, while they starve to death? Yeah, that's selfish. I'd prefer we both split the food :P We could honestly take any behaviour from our lives and question whether or not we do those things out of selfishness or not. And yet, we don't with any other behaviour, and we do with our magic. I don't feel anymore selfish or guilty or whatever about my magic than I do with anything else in my life. When I first started, I did feel guilty and a bit scared, but I think that was more to do with all the hype about magic being evil, etc. I trust my judgement, 99% of the time, and I'm sure if you opened the door to me, you're showing that you trust me enough to know what to do with my hands.

 

That's my thing with magic; we need to trust each others' judgement more when people have proven themselves in other areas to be trustworthy.


Edited by Tricycle, 07 November 2017 - 10:35 AM.

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