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TRADITIONAL WITCHCRAFT?


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#1 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 06:47 PM

I was very excited to find this forum .In my researches on the internet I have stumbled upon so much Wicca material that I started to think that they have monopolized the word "magic spell" with copyrights .I felt they made a mockery of it.I could not find a single piece of information to be useful to me (and I strongly believe in general and for anyone).I do not believe in lighting scented candles sprinkled with glitter, making up chants like it was poetry and wishing upon things using the "ancient power of wanting it really bad" - what's next... drawing a burning candle and say it represents a candle and it's good enough? this kind of magic feels like a kindergarten for "special kids".I have a background already in the magical tradition of my country, but I wanted to find connections with other traditions and deepen my knoledge.
Since I arrived here, following the discussions, I found a bit of the old stuff I was running from and less tradition than I expected.It's not the little talks, which are cute, but the actual information discussed sometimes and presented.I do not mean to be disrespectful (though I already know I set myself on fire with this post), but I only feel the need to share my concern and I need to know if there are members that share my view in making an effort to keep the old magical traditions alive.Is the forum not about traditional magic? What does "traditional" mean for you ?

I sincerely regret I anyone felt offended by my words

Edited by Unagal, 26 July 2011 - 06:58 PM.


#2 Ahrazura

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 08:02 PM

I was very excited to find this forum .In my researches on the internet I have stumbled upon so much Wicca material that I started to think that they have monopolized the word "magic spell" with copyrights .I felt they made a mockery of it.I could not find a single piece of information to be useful to me (and I strongly believe in general and for anyone).I do not believe in lighting scented candles sprinkled with glitter, making up chants like it was poetry and wishing upon things using the "ancient power of wanting it really bad" - what's next... drawing a burning candle and say it represents a candle and it's good enough? this kind of magic feels like a kindergarten for "special kids".I have a background already in the magical tradition of my country, but I wanted to find connections with other traditions and deepen my knoledge.
Since I arrived here, following the discussions, I found a bit of the old stuff I was running from and less tradition than I expected.It's not the little talks, which are cute, but the actual information discussed sometimes and presented.I do not mean to be disrespectful (though I already know I set myself on fire with this post), but I only feel the need to share my concern and I need to know if there are members that share my view in making an effort to keep the old magical traditions alive.Is the forum not about traditional magic? What does "traditional" mean for you ?

I sincerely regret I anyone felt offended by my words


Unagal,
You have not ofended me in any way but let me give you an analogy RE the wiccan slips, if you will,
Many moons ago when I was around 15 (boy I got a good memory) I began drinking in pubs. I drank a mixture of Light Ale and Bitter. It was not that I liked the stuff but it was what the older lads seemed to drink as the most popular choice. I have a lot of memories of those first years of drinking and I must admit I judge most beers by that first choice of libation. A few years later I was a larger boy as I liked it better. But how did I know it was better for my taste, by comparison.
It's the same with some, or even many, here. judgment of wicca was made and a change of direction made. I dare say this has an adverse side. If one is brought up in an air-tight tradition what can then be judged with the god given gift of reasoning. I also would further say that the old school wiccans, who now would be in their 60s,70s and 80s, where a far different magickal creature than the 'Blessed wanna-be's' that wash up as magickal dross on our world. The 'Old School' Wiccan was, and is, able to muster enough intent to make me respect them while still not wishing to be included in their number.
Oft' times there is mockery of the wiccan usage of 'Lord and Lady' yet none of a traditional bent would belittle the usage of the traditional Odin and Freyja in a post, the former two being a literal translation of the latter.
So it's a fine line we walk and them that began their pilgrimage within the ranks of wicca will I no doubt always have that gift of being able to judge what is fluffy to them from that 'past experience-present thought' axis. Does it matter if a slip hits the pages of this worthy list, no. What is important is that the current membership be able to address such issues and offer an alternative way to look at said wiccan inclusions.
So when I am around you need not run for your flame proof suit as I am not gonna burn you.

Wassail,
Ahrazura


#3 Guest_Magdalena_*

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 08:47 PM

A link for you HERE I would give a little talk but wouldn't want to come across as cute.


Because you are new here and thus a "Seeker" you would not be privy to the private forums.


#4 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 09:39 PM

Hy Ahrazura,
I realize in retrospective, after what you said, that some members are in search for a traditional path, and that some have none, but their love for witchcraft and their disillusion with other "paths" (I heard that word around a bit ).I prefer Wicca people to others (I will make no mention..), because most are kind, open-minded nature-loving people - but as far as their magic goes, I stand by my statements.I am pretty sure that someone with no knowledge in magic and a will to learn about it , if it reveres nature spirits and devotes his/her life to understanding nature it will come in possession of very profound magical knowledge - but I have seen none of that in their presentation of knowledge, and when you are set in your mind that you already know,the chances for you to actually learn diminish greatly.Mostly there is a unsavory syncretism of mythologies and traditions that has lazily been put together (I believe in general principles that here and there differ in name and description and it helps so much when correctly identified) and a tendency to praise and "golden-ageaize" some magical ancient past.All magical traditions and past pagan religions had broken parts and errors, mostly created by persons willing to connect to the spiritual world, but being too lazy to do so ( either in their research or in their practice) and still calming they did in front of others.Let us not fall in their error! Let's do investigate, and yes, let's put everything on the table to question and to analyse, but let's not forget the basics: practice an perseverance in it to see if it works or not. In my opinion traditional magic is not about rules but nevertheless you need them to guide you.How can you run a train without no tracks? I used to be frequently told when I was thought "Do not make an error or you will gather the consequences! Rehearse the chant while sitting in the church on Sundays (love chants during weddings, offensive ones when a funeral,healing chants during baptisms etc)" or "learn to see the difference between this and that because it is crucial for the success of your magic, when you do this remember to ..in order for you not to get harmed" or better yet "that's a secret, there is no business for you to know that yet"......and it worked.Now what will we do ? Toss all that and go after everything that seems more sophisticated,is presented to us as "magic" by people who confuse facts and results with belletristic narrations?Not everything that seems to make sense has one.Even after magic starts working, nobody gets all powerful,and we still need information for perfecting our magic methods.In order to add, you must open (your mind of course), but also with the opening you must use a filter, cause I see people that take everything with their wander-thirsted souls and some things lead them to get depressed and disillusioned in lack of any physical results.I don't wish anyone to get disillusioned by what I say so I often say "I don't know", or
"Just a heard tale , not checked fact" or better yet "It's a secret".I do not debate anyone's opinions - I listen to it (debating is for proselytism, for sorceress only respectful discussions goes, cause they all know something that we do not and will only have gain by respectful listening and discussing).Sometimes things that we feel very strongly about may differ but that is no problem - results are always the ones that will dictate,and sometimes information that that seems contradictory gives similar results, mainly because we do not know how to present everything with the right words.I search for tradition - if one has none, that is no problem, we all learn together.If one has none and fills it with the stuff we ran here from that will just make me sad and ultimately will damage everyone that is in a search.
I just hope that we'll all stay true to results and tradition and not get tangled in unpractical philosophies.We are all in a search and must help eachother.

Edited by Unagal, 26 July 2011 - 09:52 PM.


#5 Aloe

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 09:54 PM

I just hope that we'll all stay true to results and tradition and not get tangled in unpractical philosophies.


I predict that we'll stay true to whatever we want. And you'll figure out whether or not you want to hang with us. *shrug*

"The people who live in the Ozark country of Missouri and Arkansas were, until very recently, the most deliberately unprogressive people in the United States. Descended from pioneers who came West from the Southern Appalachians at the beginning of the nineteenth century, they made little contact with the outer world for more than a hundred years. They seem like foreigners to the average urban American, but nearly all of them come of British stock, and many families have lived in America since colonial days. Their material heirlooms are few, but like all isolated illiterates they have clung to the old songs and obsolete sayings and outworn customs of their ancestors." Ozark Magic and Folklore

#6 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 09:57 PM

I predict that we'll stay true to whatever we want. And you'll figure out whether or not you want to hang with us. *shrug*


That seems only fair :)


#7 Ahrazura

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 10:06 PM

Unagal,
May I ask, with no insult intended, if English is your first language ? I am sorry but I find your post a little hard to follow but would like to better understand the thrust of your post.

Best wishes,
Ahrazura.


#8 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 10:11 PM

Unagal,
May I ask, with no insult intended, if English is your first language ? I am sorry but I find your post a little hard to follow but would like to better understand the thrust of your post.

Best wishes,
Ahrazura.


No, English it is not my mother language, and I apologize for all the spelling errors, things that are blurry and hard to comprehend. I tried to avoid them, but I guess this is the best I did.I will read the posts and try to re-edit the mistakes. Sorry for that


#9 LdyShalott

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 10:25 PM

I just want to make an observation.. sections of this forum are public and thus can be viewed by anyone.. I for one am not comfortable going into depth about my practice in an area that anyone can google , not out of some bound oath to secrecy or a desire to sound mysterious.. but it is that I am a private person and I respect my elders and my teachings too much to hang it out in the cyber world... it has been my impression that many here feel the same way .. so in the public forums section you may see a willingness to share but only to a limit.. In addition, there are many here of varying paths and traditions.. some you will agree with and others you may find not to your taste, doesnt mean they are less valuable or less "traditional" .. "stay true to results and tradition and not get tangled in unpractical philosophies". impractical to you but path to others. ..

and for the record.. i do not burn colored candles with glitter.. and I write poetry... but do not use them as chants.. and I never make wishes... Stay or go, I enjoyed some of your contributions..

Most witches don’t believe in gods. They know that the gods exist, of course. They even deal with them occasionally. But they don’t believe in them. They know them too well. It would be like believing in the postman.  T.P.

In order to understand the living.. you have to commune with the dead..
You are a tiny little soul carrying around a corpse.-- Epictetus
All experience is an arch wherethrough gleams that untravelled world whose margin fades for ever and for ever when I move.

 


#10 Michele

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 10:37 PM

Hy Ahrazura,
I realize in retrospective, after what you said, that some members are in search for a traditional path, and that some have none, but their love for witchcraft and their disillusion with other "paths" (I heard that word around a bit ).I prefer Wicca people to others (I will make no mention..), because most are kind, open-minded nature-loving people - but as far as their magic goes, I stand by my statements.I am pretty sure that someone with no knowledge in magic and a will to learn about it , if it reveres nature spirits and devotes his/her life to understanding nature it will come in possession of very profound magical knowledge - but I have seen none of that in their presentation of knowledge, and when you are set in your mind that you already know,the chances for you to actually learn diminish greatly.Mostly there is a unsavory syncretism of mythologies and traditions that has lazily been put together (I believe in general principles that here and there differ in name and description and it helps so much when correctly identified) and a tendency to praise and "golden-ageaize" some magical ancient past.All magical traditions and past pagan religions had broken parts and errors, mostly created by persons willing to connect to the spiritual world, but being too lazy to do so ( either in their research or in their practice) and still calming they did in front of others.Let us not fall in their error! Let's do investigate, and yes, let's put everything on the table to question and to analyse, but let's not forget the basics: practice an perseverance in it to see if it works or not. In my opinion traditional magic is not about rules but nevertheless you need them to guide you.How can you run a train without no tracks? I used to be frequently told when I was thought "Do not make an error or you will gather the consequences! Rehearse the chant while sitting in the church on Sundays (love chants during weddings, offensive ones when a funeral,healing chants during baptisms etc)" or "learn to see the difference between this and that because it is crucial for the success of your magic, when you do this remember to ..in order for you not to get harmed" or better yet "that's a secret, there is no business for you to know that yet"......and it worked.Now what will we do ? Toss all that and go after everything that seems more sophisticated,is presented to us as "magic" by people who confuse facts and results with belletristic narrations?Not everything that seems to make sense has one.Even after magic starts working, nobody gets all powerful,and we still need information for perfecting our magic methods.In order to add, you must open (your mind of course), but also with the opening you must use a filter, cause I see people that take everything with their wander-thirsted souls and some things lead them to get depressed and disillusioned in lack of any physical results.I don't wish anyone to get disillusioned by what I say so I often say "I don't know", or
"Just a heard tale , not checked fact" or better yet "It's a secret".I do not debate anyone's opinions - I listen to it (debating is for proselytism, for sorceress only respectful discussions goes, cause they all know something that we do not and will only have gain by respectful listening and discussing).Sometimes things that we feel very strongly about may differ but that is no problem - results are always the ones that will dictate,and sometimes information that that seems contradictory gives similar results, mainly because we do not know how to present everything with the right words.I search for tradition - if one has none, that is no problem, we all learn together.If one has none and fills it with the stuff we ran here from that will just make me sad and ultimately will damage everyone that is in a search.
I just hope that we'll all stay true to results and tradition and not get tangled in unpractical philosophies.We are all in a search and must help eachother.


Hey Un- I do not think you are trying to offend, lol, I think you are trying to ask an honest question but not sure how to word it without offending some, which will doubtless happen :-)

I had to google cluj-napoca, and it seems you are in Romania. I am not familiar with that country, so please forgive, but I think you may have had more exposure to less "urban" type practices. Again I am only guessing... but where I am at least to find any elderly women who are trained in the old craft is about as impossible as getting the national debt figured out!! Hence, much of the practice I see in this part of the world is either Wiccan or "eclectic trad" but not particularly path-based. There are some who have had exposure to specific paths, but again, they are few and many of them only visit forums that are private to their specific path. Also, haveing less exposure to any true "wilds" (mostly only manicured parks that are very used to human feet) there has grown, I thinnk, a greater emphasis on magic itself than on contact - especially that which would happen in the wild - and there is a great difference between spirits of the wild-woods and spirits of the manicured garden. Again, I can only speak from my own perspective and what I, personally, have been exposed to. As such, most people (or I at any rate, lol) follow a path of my own making. My own personaly path happens to be deeply mystical and the basis for my path is the evolution of my Self (soul, spirit, whatever one calls it)and the practice of magic, I believe, is a by-product of the ability to make connections with the web/serpent energy/gods/whatever one calls it and that runs through all things and all people. I believe knowledge came from the "upper or starry realms" and decended into matter. That "energy" is within the earth and thereby comes from the earth, but the knowledge to work with that power/energy/virtue comes from another realm and an intercession which allowed some people (or perhaps all - who knows) the ability to learn of the ways of working with it. And ultimately the manifestation of the earth itself may have come from those "starry" realms. As for wishing really hard - mum always said that "if wishes were horses beggers would ride." I do agree that there are rules to be explored and followed within magic, especially if one is getting into occult magic rather than "folk magic." And for me, personally, it is not about power, but about ascention back to the realms from which my core came. I believe in the spirit that indwells in all living things (plants, animals, waters, etc.) and that one can develop relationships with some of these things. That some of these things have memories we don't remember. I can't speak for others, nor would I want to lol, but I hope that gives you a bit of a feeling for what I believe. Perhaps people don't know you well enough yet to state their personal beliefs, I don't know.

I think you mean well, and I think you sound like a kind person and I don't think you are trying to offend anyone - just trying to figure out what others think of things. So the above is what I think of things :-)

M


#11 Ahrazura

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 11:00 PM

No, English it is not my mother language, and I apologize for all the spelling errors, things that are blurry and hard to comprehend. I tried to avoid them, but I guess this is the best I did.I will read the posts and try to re-edit the mistakes. Sorry for that


Unagal,
Thank you,
I would love to try and help your understanding but I am an old he-hag and my eyes are a bit shot. Looking forward to your re-post.

Best wishes,
Ahrazura


#12 Aloe

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 11:12 PM

I just want to make an observation.. sections of this forum are public and thus can be viewed by anyone.. I for one am not comfortable going into depth about my practice in an area that anyone can google , not out of some bound oath to secrecy or a desire to sound mysterious.. but it is that I am a private person and I respect my elders and my teachings too much to hang it out in the cyber world... it has been my impression that many here feel the same way .. so in the public forums section you may see a willingness to share but only to a limit.. In addition, there are many here of varying paths and traditions.. some you will agree with and others you may find not to your taste, doesnt mean they are less valuable or less "traditional" .. "stay true to results and tradition and not get tangled in unpractical philosophies". impractical to you but path to others. ..

and for the record.. i do not burn colored candles with glitter.. and I write poetry... but do not use them as chants.. and I never make wishes... Stay or go, I enjoyed some of your contributions..


I agree on most of this LS, I just wasn't going to bother to explain.

Unagal maybe you have kind intentions as Michelle said (hey I've been wrong before..), but you've been here for 9 days, have 13 posts, can only see the public sections, didn't bother to respond to Magdalena's link of this site's explanation of how Traditional Witchcraft is defined here, and stated that you find the most of the information here to be Wiccan and/or impractical, so this thread appears to me like one big elitist whine that you're disappointed. Blarg.

"The people who live in the Ozark country of Missouri and Arkansas were, until very recently, the most deliberately unprogressive people in the United States. Descended from pioneers who came West from the Southern Appalachians at the beginning of the nineteenth century, they made little contact with the outer world for more than a hundred years. They seem like foreigners to the average urban American, but nearly all of them come of British stock, and many families have lived in America since colonial days. Their material heirlooms are few, but like all isolated illiterates they have clung to the old songs and obsolete sayings and outworn customs of their ancestors." Ozark Magic and Folklore

#13 LdyShalott

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 11:40 PM

I agree on most of this LS, I just wasn't going to bother to explain.

Unagal maybe you have kind intentions as Michelle said (hey I've been wrong before..), but you've been here for 9 days, have 13 posts, can only see the public sections, didn't bother to respond to Magdalena's link of this site's explanation of how Traditional Witchcraft is defined here, and stated that you find the most of the information here to be Wiccan and/or impractical, so this thread appears to me like one big elitist whine that you're disappointed. Blarg.


I was in a generous mood, rare as it is.. lol.. there seems to be a lot of that whine going around lately.. but where is the cheese???

Most witches don’t believe in gods. They know that the gods exist, of course. They even deal with them occasionally. But they don’t believe in them. They know them too well. It would be like believing in the postman.  T.P.

In order to understand the living.. you have to commune with the dead..
You are a tiny little soul carrying around a corpse.-- Epictetus
All experience is an arch wherethrough gleams that untravelled world whose margin fades for ever and for ever when I move.

 


#14 Aloe

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 11:44 PM

I was in a generous mood, rare as it is.. lol.. there seems to be a lot of that whine going around lately.. but where is the cheese???


Where indeed? ;)

"The people who live in the Ozark country of Missouri and Arkansas were, until very recently, the most deliberately unprogressive people in the United States. Descended from pioneers who came West from the Southern Appalachians at the beginning of the nineteenth century, they made little contact with the outer world for more than a hundred years. They seem like foreigners to the average urban American, but nearly all of them come of British stock, and many families have lived in America since colonial days. Their material heirlooms are few, but like all isolated illiterates they have clung to the old songs and obsolete sayings and outworn customs of their ancestors." Ozark Magic and Folklore

#15 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:02 AM

Hey Un- I do not think you are trying to offend, lol, I think you are trying to ask an honest question but not sure how to word it without offending some, which will doubtless happen :-)

I had to google cluj-napoca, and it seems you are in Romania. I am not familiar with that country, so please forgive, but I think you may have had more exposure to less "urban" type practices. Again I am only guessing... but where I am at least to find any elderly women who are trained in the old craft is about as impossible as getting the national debt figured out!! Hence, much of the practice I see in this part of the world is either Wiccan or "eclectic trad" but not particularly path-based. There are some who have had exposure to specific paths, but again, they are few and many of them only visit forums that are private to their specific path. Also, haveing less exposure to any true "wilds" (mostly only manicured parks that are very used to human feet) there has grown, I thinnk, a greater emphasis on magic itself than on contact - especially that which would happen in the wild - and there is a great difference between spirits of the wild-woods and spirits of the manicured garden. Again, I can only speak from my own perspective and what I, personally, have been exposed to. As such, most people (or I at any rate, lol) follow a path of my own making. My own personaly path happens to be deeply mystical and the basis for my path is the evolution of my Self (soul, spirit, whatever one calls it)and the practice of magic, I believe, is a by-product of the ability to make connections with the web/serpent energy/gods/whatever one calls it and that runs through all things and all people. I believe knowledge came from the "upper or starry realms" and decended into matter. That "energy" is within the earth and thereby comes from the earth, but the knowledge to work with that power/energy/virtue comes from another realm and an intercession which allowed some people (or perhaps all - who knows) the ability to learn of the ways of working with it. And ultimately the manifestation of the earth itself may have come from those "starry" realms. As for wishing really hard - mum always said that "if wishes were horses beggers would ride." I do agree that there are rules to be explored and followed within magic, especially if one is getting into occult magic rather than "folk magic." And for me, personally, it is not about power, but about ascention back to the realms from which my core came. I believe in the spirit that indwells in all living things (plants, animals, waters, etc.) and that one can develop relationships with some of these things. That some of these things have memories we don't remember. I can't speak for others, nor would I want to lol, but I hope that gives you a bit of a feeling for what I believe. Perhaps people don't know you well enough yet to state their personal beliefs, I don't know.

I think you mean well, and I think you sound like a kind person and I don't think you are trying to offend anyone - just trying to figure out what others think of things. So the above is what I think of things :-)

M



Michele
Thank you for your comment , very nice and true words :)
I think I need to know more about the people here and their beliefs

Edited by Unagal, 27 July 2011 - 12:30 AM.


#16 Jevne

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:42 AM

I was in a generous mood, rare as it is.. lol.. there seems to be a lot of that whine going around lately.. but where is the cheese???


There does seem to be an elitist, semi-preachy attitude among some of the newbies. I am trying to give the benefit of the doubt, though, because I realize how devotion to your practice or tradition can be misinterpreted as elitism or invoke defensive feelings, even if that is not the intent.

It is one thing for full members or some long-time seekers to express unhappiness with each other, even have an occasional disagreement or challenge each other's means of expressing their Path, but to have someone who has only been on the forum for a brief time accuse our forum of lacking depth or of being too wiccan is extremely offensive.

Jevne


#17 Guest_Unagal_*

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 12:53 AM

I going to post one message that I sent in private since I see that I need to say it publicly :

"Yes , ultimately I do look for magic spells but I realize we all deal with the occult, and secrets are due.Nevertheless, it would be very nice to find someone to trade general ritualdetails and specific knowledge that can be shared up to the point where it gets secret (around here no witch will tell you his/her secret gestures an chants,and I suppose this goes for me and others here).I might never meet in personany of you , and that is a thing which I regret - I'm sure I would have had abetter chance to a more positive interaction.I have no one in my country totalk openly about it.People who don't know witchcraft fear it and consequentlyme(only my brothers know about me but they never make mention of it), some donot believe, and most who practice stay hidden (except for a few "publicmedia witches" that are frauds).I have no one to share with these days.That's why I came here.I don't know what I was helping to find really... But Inever meant to be offensive - there is no point in hanging around or evenwriting a message somewhere where you are considered unpleasant and unwanted,and I get that.
I was hoping I could find anything that issomething - I have so much respect for other traditions and it would beboastful of me to say "My ways are good enough and I need to know nomore".Some things relate so well that missing pieces from one lore completewonderfully broken pieces for another, and I do believe that magic isuniversal.
If I will see that I am to be found unpleasant bya few older members that have a wide net of friends anyway, than I failed andthere is no point for me being here - I will retreat to my studies and my experiments alone.But from time to time I remember that even in my country witches used to meet in the old times a few times a year with their peers and Ifear that total seclusion upon the matter will only lead me to things I do notwant for myself."


I goggled Traditional Witchcraft in order to find people I could relate to. Instead I touched sensitive cords and managed to upset people.Perhaps some threads shouldn't be made public, otherwise I see no point in creating an account, of just to create another site just for socializing.
I guess I will take my leave and wish you all well and a deeper understanding of witchcraft.

Edited by Unagal, 27 July 2011 - 12:56 AM.


#18 Aloe

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 01:06 AM

I going to post one message that I sent in private since I see that I need to say it publicly :

"Yes , ultimately I do look for magic spells but I realize we all deal with the occult, and secrets are due.Nevertheless, it would be very nice to find someone to trade general ritualdetails and specific knowledge that can be shared up to the point where it gets secret (around here no witch will tell you his/her secret gestures an chants,and I suppose this goes for me and others here).I might never meet in personany of you , and that is a thing which I regret - I'm sure I would have had abetter chance to a more positive interaction.I have no one in my country totalk openly about it.People who don't know witchcraft fear it and consequentlyme(only my brothers know about me but they never make mention of it), some donot believe, and most who practice stay hidden (except for a few "publicmedia witches" that are frauds).I have no one to share with these days.That's why I came here.I don't know what I was helping to find really... But Inever meant to be offensive - there is no point in hanging around or evenwriting a message somewhere where you are considered unpleasant and unwanted,and I get that.
I was hoping I could find anything that issomething - I have so much respect for other traditions and it would beboastful of me to say "My ways are good enough and I need to know nomore".Some things relate so well that missing pieces from one lore completewonderfully broken pieces for another, and I do believe that magic isuniversal.
If I will see that I am to be found unpleasant bya few older members that have a wide net of friends anyway, than I failed andthere is no point for me being here - I will retreat to my studies and my experiments alone.But from time to time I remember that even in my country witches used to meet in the old times a few times a year with their peers and Ifear that total seclusion upon the matter will only lead me to things I do notwant for myself."


I goggled Traditional Witchcraft in order to find people I could relate to. Instead I touched sensitive cords and managed to upset people.Perhaps some threads shouldn't be made public, otherwise I see no point in creating an account, of just to create another site just for socializing.
I guess I will take my leave and wish you all well and a deeper understanding of witchcraft.


Mr. U, had you taken time to get to know us before accusing us of lacking depth, you might have found what you were looking for. I don't think you were considered unpleasant or unwanted before that. You said yourself that you knew you set yourself on fire with your OP in this thread, why would you do that before giving us a chance to get to know you?

"The people who live in the Ozark country of Missouri and Arkansas were, until very recently, the most deliberately unprogressive people in the United States. Descended from pioneers who came West from the Southern Appalachians at the beginning of the nineteenth century, they made little contact with the outer world for more than a hundred years. They seem like foreigners to the average urban American, but nearly all of them come of British stock, and many families have lived in America since colonial days. Their material heirlooms are few, but like all isolated illiterates they have clung to the old songs and obsolete sayings and outworn customs of their ancestors." Ozark Magic and Folklore

#19 8people

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 01:21 AM

To be honest, if he had taken the time to read the stickied posts in the Forum Rules area (The one labeled PLEASE READ in capital letters) you would already know that the more 'advanced' and heavier topics aren't open to seekers and it takes time, patience and respect to earn access.

#20 Michele

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 01:29 AM

I was very excited to find this forum .In my researches on the internet I have stumbled upon so much Wicca material that I started to think that they have monopolized the word "magic spell" with copyrights .I felt they made a mockery of it.I could not find a single piece of information to be useful to me (and I strongly believe in general and for anyone).I do not believe in lighting scented candles sprinkled with glitter, making up chants like it was poetry and wishing upon things using the "ancient power of wanting it really bad" - what's next... drawing a burning candle and say it represents a candle and it's good enough? this kind of magic feels like a kindergarten for "special kids".I have a background already in the magical tradition of my country, but I wanted to find connections with other traditions and deepen my knoledge.
Since I arrived here, following the discussions, I found a bit of the old stuff I was running from and less tradition than I expected.It's not the little talks, which are cute, but the actual information discussed sometimes and presented.I do not mean to be disrespectful (though I already know I set myself on fire with this post), but I only feel the need to share my concern and I need to know if there are members that share my view in making an effort to keep the old magical traditions alive.Is the forum not about traditional magic? What does "traditional" mean for you ?

I sincerely regret I anyone felt offended by my words


Becuase I did not feel he was trying to be offensive, but was trying to ask something and perhaps not getting hte wording correct, and English is not his first language, I pm'd him. He is in Romania (as he says in his profile)and what he has been exposed to in the culture he is from is extremely differnet from what is openly available in the western world (and I must admit extremely interesting) and I think it is more culture shock and that he was honestly not trying to offend but to compare notes on some of the magical traditions and workings he has collected in his country and he was/is extremely willing to share what he has gathered in his travels and path. I found him down-to-earth and really just trying to find a place where he can talk of charms and mythologies and spells he has gathered and "swap stories" and as so much folklore has been lost (especially oral lore) that is really the only way to do that. I think he meant no harm, and he was really a very polite and likeable fellow in the pm's and he's not looking for anything one-sided as he has already shown by the interesting bits he has already posted - he's very willing to share.

I do not think he accused us of being Wiccan, he just stated some things he didn't like about Wicca, but also stated that most of them are nice poeple but not the craft he is interested in.

M