Jump to content

Meditation/Visualisation


Stacey

Recommended Posts

Does anyone else have trouble in these areas? I have to say I suck at meditation, I have a mind that works all the time, it never quiets and any attempt to do so end ups in a headache. I did try using a guided chakra meditation once, but dammit, no matter how hard I tried I could not see the white triange or whirling red vortex :vhappywitch: .

 

I'm also not so great with visualisation - I see but not see if that makes sense. If some one says 'See the green apple' I will have the thought of seeing it but won't see it. I think I tend to visualise in the form of words not pictures.

 

I was wondering what tips anyone has for expanding my ever so lame skills in these two areas?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I gotta say, I suck at a lot of stuff, but meditation and visualization isn't one of them....I do ok with that. I kinda think that if you are a natural 'daydreamer' or if your mind wanders a lot (like mine, lol), it might come easier. Some people are so focused on their task, so concentrated, that it's hard for them to relax.

 

Anyway, I have read that for beginners with this, it's best to make the mind a 'movie screen', like at the theatre house with all the movies. You picture a blank screen and then, once or twice a day, focus on changing the colors only on the screen, say from green, to pink, to lavender, to blue, etc. Once you get that down and can make the screen go into any color, you then start adding a simple picture, like.....a yellow daisy in a field of green, or .....a green toad on a lilypad. Easy stuff. Just concentrate for 2-3 minutes on your picture, then let it go. I've heard from others that this is a great exercise and warms up the right brain (where, if I'm not mistaken), all our creative and imaginative juices flow.

 

I hope this at least helps a little and gets you started... :)

B

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am sure that many of our friends here will give you excellent advice on tips and techniques for visualization and meditation. In fact, this topic has been discussed before, so you might want to do a quick search of the forum.

 

That being said, you won't get any advice on the subject from me, simply because I suck at both techniques, too. The reason being that everything I do mundanely and magically has to have a purpose. Neither visualization nor meditation in the strictest defintion do anything at all for me, personally.

 

I mean, what the hell is the purpose of seeing a "green apple"? Why do I care about white triangles or red vortexes? I don't, and the reason that you can't visualize them is that you probably don't either. This lack of "skill" hasn't stopped me, and I doubt it will you. You'll just need to find your own way to reach toward your goals.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I do find visualization helpful in focusing on the outcome of a spell when I'm charming depending on what I am doing. I also find it helpful at times if I am making something (figure, poppet, etc.) to be able to see the finished figure. I have an exercise I do which I refer to as "jumping" but is is actually going into a trnace staqte and then "jumping into" something - whether a picture, some place I saw in nature, a skull, etc. I use the jump off point as an entrance. Until one feels comfortable doing this I found the best "push" was to visualize the travel whether it actually happened or not, and as such it goes a long way into dropping down into that "deep day-dream state" (which is not necessarily a "day-dream" in the strict sense of the word) and then the journey takes off on its own and you are no longer visualizing it but experiencing it. I have found some visualization exercises to be good for focus practice, but as I am not overly good at holding images in my mind I often use as a form of focus a chant with a kind of "crazy lady" rocking motion back and forth in time to the chant and the chant being muttered (again crazy-lady fashion) over and over just under my breath. I find I can really drop down quickly using that combination.

 

M

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know how you feel. It took me a long time but I also learned that you don't need to meditate to have visuals. I concentrate on my 3rd eye, sometimes I have to put a couple fingers on the area to help. At first they will come as shadow blobs or monotone like. With practice it will turn to full color pictures and then things will play like a movie. You can control what you want to see or just go random. It took me years to be able to relax enough to meditate, kava kava, chamomile, damiana or pot (for real) helps me when I can't quiet my mind enough.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

patchoulisky

Ok, my caveat here is that I'm not the greatest at meditation, but I try. My biggest mistake was trying to do all the chakra, third eye, kundalini kind of stuff right off the bat. I think that the best way to approach meditation is to just learn to quiet the mind, which absolutely everyone had difficulties with at first. Jon Kabat-Zinn is an doctor who had been meditating for almost 30 years. He has written books about it, done videos, and speaks to groups. His approach to meditation is simple and I think it's a great place to start, even if you desire to go beyond simple meditation.

 

Here's a

to a YouTube video of him talking to the employees at Google. It's long, over an hour, but it's well worth your time. The guy who introduces him at the beginning is goofy, but Kabat-Zinn talks about the basics of meditation, and then at about the 24:00 mark, he leads a meditation. You can do this right at your computer desk, or wherever you are watching the video.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 7 months later...

Stacey, if you still need tips - I have great success with a meditation dvd by Ravi Singh and Ana Brett. I have not only a lot of mental clatter at times but also have major pain issues due to severe arthritis, etc. I tried other methods of meditation as i was intrigued by the benefits. Nothing really worked, or rather, I just didn't enjoy it.

 

I do daily kundalini yoga so adding one or more of the meditations from the RaviAna Meditation dvd is simple. I notice I feel better, my weight is stable, I sleep better and more focussed. I notice a big difference if I skip a few days.

 

The reason i like the dvd is there is trippy ambient music and particular breathing or chantings that just resonate with me. Good luck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone else have trouble in these areas? I have to say I suck at meditation, I have a mind that works all the time, it never quiets and any attempt to do so end ups in a headache. I did try using a guided chakra meditation once, but dammit, no matter how hard I tried I could not see the white triange or whirling red vortex :vhappywitch: .

 

I'm also not so great with visualisation - I see but not see if that makes sense. If some one says 'See the green apple' I will have the thought of seeing it but won't see it. I think I tend to visualise in the form of words not pictures.

 

I was wondering what tips anyone has for expanding my ever so lame skills in these two areas?

If you're not good with visuals, try other senses as well. In my visualizations (and I'm not that good, either, but practice has helped) I have to add touch to make the experience more real. Sound next. And the beginning is always the same - a walk from a farmhouse porch through a backyard (with an old swingset - with chipped and wearing multi-colored paint (from multiple coats of paint, something from my elementary school playground), through a wooden fence that opens into a field of tall grass or tall golden wheat, (or fallow field, depending). I run my fingers over the tops of the plants as I walk through. There's a dirt path that I follow, then a wooden section where I take off my shoes, then smooth river stones, then the tree that I use as the splitting point of where I'm going. And when I'm stressed about "hurrying through the intro" I give myself a certain number of deep breaths to take before I allow myself to engage with the tree or split off to one of the other places. By that time, I've sunk into a pretty good state and I can go different places I've envisioned from there. I have specific memory sensations that go with each phase of the visualization, so I can link more quickly to the experience.

 

I use visualization and meditation to handle issues, dig deep into myself for answers, and meet with spirits and/or deities. I've also found that if I focus too much on what others say I should envision, then it's harder to do. I get too stressed about not doing it right rather than relaxing and intuiting it along. Use others' suggestions as jumping off points rather than hard and fast requirements. I've even changed the colors of my chakra visuals because the original colors didn't synch with my visualizations.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you have to literally talk yourself through your meditations/visualizations, you certainly can. Start simple... You might recall the time you saw a yellow dress you saw on a mannequin, the texture of the fabric, was it a high waist, drop waist, etc. Then begin to practice seeing things that "are not." Thinking about details, like if you're visualizing a pink alligator, like Abhainn suggested, use your other senses. Does the gator stink or smell like roses? Does he have a cheerful affect or does he seem grumpy? Does he make any noise while he's waddling around your floor? Does he feel like an old callused heel? What shade of pink is he? It's silly, but you get the idea. Force yourself to look at the nuance of detail.

 

And learning to look and examine things in your daily life will help you in visualization/meditation. This is easy for a snoopy person like me who has to stare at/touch everything. ;) You'll do just fine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

These are great suggestions. The only thing I would add is to constantly practice and don't give up. The mind is like a muscle, if not used and challenged than it will weaken. This applies to all mental abilities. Just because you can't do something now, it only means that you need find a way that works and practice it. For example, when I was very little I saw someone with the ability to wiggle their ears. As hard as I tried I could not wiggle my ears. I spent ever night as a child trying to find my "trigger", trying to feel the muscle and make it move. After years of practise I was finally able to wiggle my ears. Now, I can really move my left one, but i can only slightly move my right one because I didn't focus on that one, that muscle was harder to feel for me. I still practise that one and I have made some progress. Visualization is no different. If you are not used to doing it and doing it strongly, than you will have to practice and it isn't going to be an overnight thing. It may take years to get the ability where you want it. On the flip side, there are people that have been doing this kind of thing since they were children and they are used to "moving that muscle" so to speak and have no need to "practise". One is not better than the other, it is just a muscle you had little need to use.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think instead of quieting your mind, try seeing what you are thinking about. If your mind is on groceries or studying, try and see the grocery store and imagine walking in it--just try you might only get flashes, but your mind is already on shopping why not keep it there instead of working against it. If your mind is on a test, try and see the test paper and imagine taking it, etc. Again even if you only see a flash you are already well on your way.

 

The whole quieting your mind thing is necessary for meditation, but not for visualization. I think its best to split the two skills off from one another, you will be less stressed then and I think you will make more progress in both if you aren't shooting for a two in one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

The whole quieting your mind thing is necessary for meditation, but not for visualization. I think its best to split the two skills off from one another, you will be less stressed then and I think you will make more progress in both if you aren't shooting for a two in one.

 

Depends on the situation, at least for me. If you're just getting started learning visualization, yes, you can jump around and picture whatever. But that focus needs to be developed as well for later, when you need to extend the visualization for any length of time. And that does require a good amount of "quiet mind" or else you'll have random visions/thoughts that could distract you from your intent. I've had many a Stephen King-esque random WTF image in my visualizations that distracted me enough cause problems. And I've tried to add too much sensory material that also distracted from the process. But my purpose for the visualization was something more akin to meditation - a meeting or spiritual process - and that required me to block out external thoughts and focus on both the spiritual and visual/physical aspects.

 

But again, it depends on the purpose. I've had a lot of fun just visualizing myself in various shapes and circumstances without actually doing any "meditation." Just winging (or slithering, or skittering, or...) around.

 

Sara makes a good point. Keeping the two skills separate to strengthen both individually will help immensely when you need to put them together for an extended visual meditation, etc. And I don't mean for this to sound like I'm splitting hairs, and I'm certainly not arguing. Eventually, the two skills will naturally merge. Practicing them separately and together will help in different ways.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Depends on the situation, at least for me. If you're just getting started learning visualization, yes, you can jump around and picture whatever. But that focus needs to be developed as well for later, when you need to extend the visualization for any length of time. And that does require a good amount of "quiet mind" or else you'll have random visions/thoughts that could distract you from your intent. I've had many a Stephen King-esque random WTF image in my visualizations that distracted me enough cause problems. And I've tried to add too much sensory material that also distracted from the process. But my purpose for the visualization was something more akin to meditation - a meeting or spiritual process - and that required me to block out external thoughts and focus on both the spiritual and visual/physical aspects.

 

But again, it depends on the purpose. I've had a lot of fun just visualizing myself in various shapes and circumstances without actually doing any "meditation." Just winging (or slithering, or skittering, or...) around.

 

Sara makes a good point. Keeping the two skills separate to strengthen both individually will help immensely when you need to put them together for an extended visual meditation, etc. And I don't mean for this to sound like I'm splitting hairs, and I'm certainly not arguing. Eventually, the two skills will naturally merge. Practicing them separately and together will help in different ways.

 

I totally agree, once you have one or both of them down then you can put the two together.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You've already got some great suggestions here. Maybe what I'm about to say is similar to some of the previous advice, so just my two pennies worth.

 

For meditation, just focus on your breath or even the sounds around you. You don't have to try to concentrate to the point where your head explodes. Just feel your breath. Listen to the sound of traffic or birds or whatever is in your sound-scape. Start simple, you don't have to do chakra travels or any complex chanting or the like. Take it one breath at the time. If you forget to focus on your breathing, just feel the next breath. Start with short periods of time, maybe just 10 minutes.

 

To improve your concentration you might want to try a technique called Tatrak (it's yogic). Sit in a dark room with a lit candle at the height of your eyes. Focus on the flame, the very point where the wick meets the flame. Do this for a minute or two then blow out the candle and close your eyes. You will see a spot of light before your inner eye. Follow it and focus on it for as long as it's there.

 

I'm not really great with visualisation myself but starting just watching your inner screen can be a big help. You don't even have to try to see anything. Just watch the dark. After a while shapes might appear. Just try to remain conscious and don't fall asleep. Stay in this twilight zone for as long as you can. Images will probably emerge spontaneously, like they would in a dream. This might improve your confidence in your ability to actually see things. Visualising something specific at will might come later. I find that starting with lights and colours are the easiest. Don't bet yourself up if whatever you attempt to visualise don't appear exactly the way you want it to and as suggested before you can use your other senses aswell.

 

One last thing - and this is advice I'm giving myself as well! Patience and practice! The two P's.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think I'm actually having a hard time imagining someone having a hard time visualizing something.. wait, is that irony or what? ;)

Seriously though, I'm such a daydreamer, it comes naturally.. what doesn't come so naturally is the discipline to control what I visualize, my attention just flutters on the wind, from one thing to another sometimes.

That's where the meditation comes in, I value it as "mind control", but over your own mind instead of someone else's. Most people would not be very comfortable with themselves if their right arm occasionally just did whatever random movement it wanted to, we shouldn't regard our minds any differently.

The ability to focus and stay focused seems to me one of the most useful tools anyone could possess.

I wish I could devote more time to meditation but with a near 11 year old in the house.. it's next to impossible.

 

If I have any tips or ideas to impart, it would be to not only attempt to visualize literally (that is, to only see), say, a green apple, (or whatever- a winning lottery ticket works too!), but feel it.. it's texture, it's thickness/thinness, it's weight in your hand. If an apple, imagine biting into it, tasting it, feeling the juice run down your chin a little.. hear the "crack" as your teeth break it's skin, it's smell under your nose. Make it a "5D" experience.. well, 5S anyway.

OTOH, for some things, it doesn't even have to be visual at all, really.. take for example, a curse, where you "visualize" -for lack of a better term- your target's sorrow, frustration, regret and despair; or a love spell, where you feel the target's love and adoration (this should be easy).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 year later...

I read in a book (I cannot recall which) that visualisation is identical to imagining. While this certainly may not be true for some people, I think it is an interesting concept. I certainly do not do well with seeing things in the mind's eye movie screen, but I am excellent at imagining. I do not think I would have any success seeing a green apple on the backs of my eyelids, but I could imagine picking one, washing it, cutting it, smelling it, how it looks and how it tastes, and eating it. Even though I do not have "visions" I still have very strong "experiences", which for me are more valuable in the end. Sometimes I get carried away and give myself a new reality or memory in a specific situation. Like, when I am mad at someone I fantasize a situation in which they were a total shithead and imagine it out for a while. Then I'm all angry and self-justified, and I want to phone my friends and tell them what the person did that was so stupid, except of course it was all in my head. 

 

I have always been curious as to the extra emphasis on visualization, as I can't think of any situation where seeing something on the mental movie screen would be of any use to me. I used to feel very downtrodden that I couldn't induce visions at will, because a lot of people do seem to consider it as being of utmost importance. I am still interested in trying to develop that skill as it seems like a good mental exercise (and fun!) but I don't grok the speciality of it so far.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I read in a book (I cannot recall which) that visualisation is identical to imagining. While this certainly may not be true for some people, I think it is an interesting concept. I certainly do not do well with seeing things in the mind's eye movie screen, but I am excellent at imagining. I do not think I would have any success seeing a green apple on the backs of my eyelids, but I could imagine picking one, washing it, cutting it, smelling it, how it looks and how it tastes, and eating it. Even though I do not have "visions" I still have very strong "experiences", which for me are more valuable in the end. Sometimes I get carried away and give myself a new reality or memory in a specific situation. Like, when I am mad at someone I fantasize a situation in which they were a total shithead and imagine it out for a while. Then I'm all angry and self-justified, and I want to phone my friends and tell them what the person did that was so stupid, except of course it was all in my head. 

 

I have always been curious as to the extra emphasis on visualization, as I can't think of any situation where seeing something on the mental movie screen would be of any use to me. I used to feel very downtrodden that I couldn't induce visions at will, because a lot of people do seem to consider it as being of utmost importance. I am still interested in trying to develop that skill as it seems like a good mental exercise (and fun!) but I don't grok the speciality of it so far.

 

 

 

 

I think the reason so many put so much importance on visualization is because its an exercise in manifesting something created in the mind, one that is very popular in witchcraft 101 books. For a lot of people it helps them control and focus their will to bring manifestation of their desires. Everyone is different though.  I do not think visualization, in the way you describe with the mental movie screen behind the eyes, is needed for absolutely everyone or in every situation. It is a way, but not the only way. There are several ways desires can be manifested.  Many people use a visual aid such a poppet, or other prop to help focus what they want.  Others use words, songs or play actions in ritual. Look at many tribal rituals with their songs and ritual dress and dances.  These are useful because the help the trance mindset and they help people to visualize the goal.  One is not better than another, they all achieve the same purpose. 

 

 For me, I think of what I want, I find my emotional trigger and build the energy and I release.  I do not sit and try to bring a photo image of what I want to the screen behind my eyes.  I have tried that and find it to be a waste of energy as it is an unnecessary step for me. I just use different "muscles".  I am more emotional than mental and I use that to my advantage.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

achieve the same purpose. 

 

I just use different "muscles".  I am more emotional than mental and I use that to my advantage.

I think that is one of the keys to manifesting. Use what you are strong in, what you are good at...feeling, hearing, tasting, touching, etc. The more you bring in, the better result, but primarily use what you are good at. Visualization, although one of the tools, is not the end and be all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

 

I think that is one of the keys to manifesting. Use what you are strong in, what you are good at...feeling, hearing, tasting, touching, etc. The more you bring in, the better result, but primarily use what you are good at. Visualization, although one of the tools, is not the end and be all.

Very well said Autumn Moon,  some of us Witches have difficulty with this process.  Some equate "visualization" like the steering wheel of a vehicle. But yes it is a tool,  I personally use symbols, drawings or pictures as tools to help me focus my concentration.  Tools by themselves have little power, but they allow the Witch to imprint the energy drawn from inside the Witch as a need of sorts, this gives a type of steering coupled with the power, and it's outcome or destination, from what I've experienced for myself, as I did find it a process of what worked for me and or didn't work for me.

 

 

Regards,

Gypsy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

For me it all depends on where my mind is I'm way to good at visualization and can get lost in there which sounds great but can be a real problem. I have a harder time meditating because that requires my mind to be calm and its not what I have found helps is meditating while floating in water for some reason this really works for me. I don't necisarily think you have to meditate though and you can meditate while doing things like running or doing dishes just find what ever calms you and do it then. I don't think there is ever a one size fits all of anything we are all diffrent and that's because our minds are so diffrent. As long as your comfortable with your self that's really what matter. I too like learning new things especially mental exercises so if your wanting to learn these skills that's great just doent be hard on yourself about it because we all have strengths and weaknesses learning to over come those weaknesses and turn them into strengths is a great goal.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

I relate completely with WR's analogy of learning to find the "muscle" and then learning to move it and or flex. I actually learned to wiggle my ears the same way and as silly as it may sound to some, it's what I relate many things to. Meditation is a little different. For me, doing mindless tasks, such as chopping vegetables or doing dishes, calms my conscious mind and allows my subconscious to take over and allow a sort of meditation or visualization. However, if I concentrate on it at all, poof! it's gone. I can't remember what that type of meditation is called but I recall Mountain Witch mentioning it in another thread. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

I used to think I was no good in these areas either, until I realised all I had to do was focus, and quieten my internal chatter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Buddhists call that the monkey mind, because it runs all over the place. So, like a wild animal, you have to tether it to one spot. Same with the mind, chose a focus, such as a candle flame, breathing, etc. and focus your full being on that one thing. It takes practice, but everyone can do it (some better than others).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I have always been curious as to the extra emphasis on visualization, as I can't think of any situation where seeing something on the mental movie screen would be of any use to me. I used to feel very downtrodden that I couldn't induce visions at will, because a lot of people do seem to consider it as being of utmost importance. I am still interested in trying to develop that skill as it seems like a good mental exercise (and fun!) but I don't grok the speciality of it so far.

 

I agree, Wexler.  I have never understood the emphasis on "visualization".  I mean, if it works for you, great, but I reject the implication that one has to meditate or has to visualize or has to do anything.  I work magic all the time, and I generally do not visualize; doesn't work for me, total waste of time.  But, I can see some merit to your other comment; if one is weak in visualization and thinks it might help, spending some time on learning the technique may prove useful.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...