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The Darkness Within


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#1 RavensClaw

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 12:31 PM

Ok, This is a fairly new concept to me and I haven't fully gathered my thoughts on this topic so please bear with me if it get's a little disjointed.

I have become aware in recent times that to follow a traditional path, you must first embrace the dark as well as the light side of nature. As with most things trad related its a matter of working intraspectively. Finding the Darkness within, to understand the darkness externally.

So here it goes! What is this dark aspect of nature to you? I have heard of it refered to as the bringer of life in the few places I have been able to find any reference to it at all. It seems from an acedmic point of view it stems from a great nothing, which in turn spewed forth existance.... eventually to reclaim it. What do you make of this? Do you give the darkness a name, and if you don't mind sharing it, what is it?

To me, the how darkness brought forth life is niether here nor there. It may have been the case, it may not. To me, my priority is living the tradition not looking to the past and keeping it a thing of history. What I'm trying to say is that I want a working knowledge of it, it doesn't matter where it came from or where its going to, just that it IS in this instant we live in called the present.

What is your opinion of it? Where it came from and is going to?

How have you embraced the darkness?

How has it influenced you and your practice?

When would you use this great viod in a working?

That's it for now but I'm sure I'll have more questions as we go along.

Regards,

RC

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#2 Sandy

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 01:02 PM

What a fab topic. To me darkness is the same as light, only opposite. Every single thing on this planet relies on both forces.

For example, you can't make a torch work with the batteries upside down - the conducter (us perhaps?) is there and the battery is the universal energy as I see it. When you put the battery in the right way up, you have positive and negative energy coming together to manifest into your desire.

I work alot with dark energy - it is not always bad, but it is necessary for death, decay and rebirth. I use dark energy in many of my workings, especially for protection and hexes, but mostly for when I am doing a serious healing.

One cannot help a cancer sufferer by sending them positive energy and love and light - the cancer cells will LOVE it and probably grow even faster. Here I would use dark/negative energy and pinpoint the cancer to kill it off. Afterwards, I would then send the person positive energy but focus it away from the cancer area.

It works for me, and the dark should be fully embraced and accepted just as the light for there cannot be one without the other, otherwise, for sure, there would be no existence of mankind, the Earth, or the Universe for that matter.

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#3 AnjelWolf

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 01:09 PM

Ok, This is a fairly new concept to me and I haven't fully gathered my thoughts on this topic so please bear with me if it get's a little disjointed.

I have become aware in recent times that to follow a traditional path, you must first embrace the dark as well as the light side of nature. As with most things trad related its a matter of working intraspectively. Finding the Darkness within, to understand the darkness externally.

So here it goes! What is this dark aspect of nature to you? I have heard of it refered to as the bringer of life in the few places I have been able to find any reference to it at all. It seems from an acedmic point of view it stems from a great nothing, which in turn spewed forth existance.... eventually to reclaim it. What do you make of this? Do you give the darkness a name, and if you don't mind sharing it, what is it?

To me, the how darkness brought forth life is niether here nor there. It may have been the case, it may not. To me, my priority is living the tradition not looking to the past and keeping it a thing of history. What I'm trying to say is that I want a working knowledge of it, it doesn't matter where it came from or where its going to, just that it IS in this instant we live in called the present.

What is your opinion of it? Where it came from and is going to?

How have you embraced the darkness?

How has it influenced you and your practice?

When would you use this great viod in a working?

That's it for now but I'm sure I'll have more questions as we go along.

Regards,

RC



Excellent topic here :) Yes I prefer the dark as Sandy does as well. The energy is more intense and packs "one hell of a punch" to any situation (whether it is healing, curses, love, protection, finances, anything).

To me...the dark is where life & light originated from. It is the basic source of all power and energy.

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#4 RavensClaw

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 02:03 PM

ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH!!!!! I just did a whole big post thingy and deleted it by accident!!!!!!!

Bugger, I'll have to post it later.

Thanks for the response so far..... there interesting.

RC

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#5 Sandy

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 02:39 PM

hahahaaaaaa ... sorry to laugh, been there done that .. aint it a bitch!
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#6 RavensClaw

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 07:20 PM

Yip...... can't get time to re-type it either. Family stuff, I'll write a proper post tomorrow when there aren't kids under foot.

RC

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#7 Daemion

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 08:16 PM

I like this topic. Ive always been drawn to the darker aspect of things. To me it is where everything started from. Ive had success with working with darker energies regardless of what the working is for. It's just a part of the natural order of things. Nothing scary or evil about it.
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#8 Earth Mother

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 08:52 PM

Very interesting topic. I don`t post much but read a lot.

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#9 AnjelWolf

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 09:37 PM

Very interesting topic. I don`t post much but read a lot.

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I can see this...so what are your thoughts on this topic?

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#10 Earth Mother

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Posted 27 June 2007 - 10:41 PM

I said interesting topic because I can associate it with Yin and Yan you must have the dark to have the light. Your ideas on fighting cancers or in fact any illness with dark energies and then the light caught my attention because I also use crystals, using a smokey quartz or a dark stone to draw out the dis-ease or pain and then a clear quartz to put energy back.
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Posted 28 June 2007 - 06:39 AM

For me I am happy to embrace my darker side. I spend years as a Buddhist trying to transform it into a lotus etc(!) but the darn goo kept on surfacing! Whenever I reveal this side I get comments from friends and family- they are not used to it and see it as socially unacceptable. But we all know different, don't we?!:eek:
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#12 RavensClaw

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 10:52 AM

What a fab topic. To me darkness is the same as light, only opposite. Every single thing on this planet relies on both forces.

For example, you can't make a torch work with the batteries upside down - the conducter (us perhaps?) is there and the battery is the universal energy as I see it. When you put the battery in the right way up, you have positive and negative energy coming together to manifest into your desire.

I work alot with dark energy - it is not always bad, but it is necessary for death, decay and rebirth. I use dark energy in many of my workings, especially for protection and hexes, but mostly for when I am doing a serious healing.

One cannot help a cancer sufferer by sending them positive energy and love and light - the cancer cells will LOVE it and probably grow even faster. Here I would use dark/negative energy and pinpoint the cancer to kill it off. Afterwards, I would then send the person positive energy but focus it away from the cancer area.

It works for me, and the dark should be fully embraced and accepted just as the light for there cannot be one without the other, otherwise, for sure, there would be no existence of mankind, the Earth, or the Universe for that matter.


Thank you for responding in such a splended way. As a former nurse I can understand the target specific manner in which you use it.

I was also wondering, and bear with me on this. To me everything is natural ie cityscape as well as the countryside etc If this is the case then it would only be a small step to presume that as a wood may have a genius loci, then this principle could be true of any environment.

If this is the case have you ever work with the spirit of say pollution, crime, war etc Or do you view it as an energy without a personification? Either way how would you call upon this to use it? (please forgive me if this last bit has caused offense, I would just like to know how you lot interact with this darker aspect and use it in workings).

Hi AnjelWolf, you posted:

Excellent topic here :) Yes I prefer the dark as Sandy does as well. The energy is more intense and packs "one hell of a punch" to any situation (whether it is healing, curses, love, protection, finances, anything).

To me...the dark is where life & light originated from. It is the basic source of all power and energy.


Thank you for the compliment. Why does it pack more of a punch?

Do you find it easier to work with than the more widely recognised Light aspect of the craft?

Could you expand on ...... dark is where light and life originated from? I know I said that this wasn't my priority but as a matter of interest it is worth taking note of.

I forgotten half of what I wrote up that I wiped, but this will do for now.

As I've said before, I'm trying to build a working knowledge of the Darkness within. I have never used this before, so I don't want to mess it up.

I would be kean on hearing of any experiences you have had working with your inner darkness. Do you have any exercise you use to explore it?

Thats enough for now.

Cheers,

RC

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#13 Sandy

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 11:08 AM

I was also wondering, and bear with me on this. To me everything is natural ie cityscape as well as the countryside etc If this is the case then it would only be a small step to presume that as a wood may have a genius loci, then this principle could be true of any environment.

If this is the case have you ever work with the spirit of say pollution, crime, war etc Or do you view it as an energy without a personification? Either way how would you call upon this to use it? (please forgive me if this last bit has caused offense, I would just like to know how you lot interact with this darker aspect and use it in workings).


Right .. now personally I cannot focus as good in a city as well as I can literally amongst nature with roots that are buried deep into the Earth and is pulsating with energy. To me a cityscape represents destruction and pollution and the energy for me is ALOT different. Maybe it is ME that is different for I cannot stand city life for long.

No, I have never worked with energies from war or pollution and never will. To me this is man made and has not come directly from any natural source of the Universal Energy. I do not put this energy into the same category as darkness, to me, war, crime etc is a man-made manifestation of evil itself from greed and can not be controlled or manipulated.

Darkness is all around us - some people even assume that necromancy is a form of working with dark energy. We all perceive it differently - you just have to find what stirs the darkness in you and work with it, for my "darkness within" could be entirely different from yours.

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#14 Cairelle

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 11:51 AM

I don't have any problem focusing in a city! I guess because the energy of the city I'm in potentiates what I do, so to speak. I do love the country too and can focus there as well, but in a different manner. My work in the city seems more intense.

As far as darkness goes, it's just as much a part of who I am as is light. As a nurse I agree 100% with Sandy's way of working on sickness. Sending light would only cause the illness to thrive. The power of darkness is what wipes it out.

This is a great thread and I have more to say but right now I have to go to work, lol...

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#15 Sandy

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 01:01 PM

You are lucky KW. I lived in busy London all my life and by my mid 20s I just couldn't take it anymore and travelled round Australia. I then moved to Germany and then, again, lived in busy Munich for a further 6 years. I became a gibbering mess towards the end.

Finally, I settled in the middle of forests and rivers and lakes in Rheinland Pfalz and for me it is so energizing to see nature at it's full. No motorway cutting through the landscape, no noise, no dirt and thankfully not too many people either (me being such an antisocial bitch an' all lol)
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#16 AnjelWolf

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Posted 28 June 2007 - 07:20 PM

Thank you for responding in such a splended way. As a former nurse I can understand the target specific manner in which you use it.

I was also wondering, and bear with me on this. To me everything is natural ie cityscape as well as the countryside etc If this is the case then it would only be a small step to presume that as a wood may have a genius loci, then this principle could be true of any environment.

If this is the case have you ever work with the spirit of say pollution, crime, war etc Or do you view it as an energy without a personification? Either way how would you call upon this to use it? (please forgive me if this last bit has caused offense, I would just like to know how you lot interact with this darker aspect and use it in workings).

Hi AnjelWolf, you posted:

Excellent topic here :) Yes I prefer the dark as Sandy does as well. The energy is more intense and packs "one hell of a punch" to any situation (whether it is healing, curses, love, protection, finances, anything).

To me...the dark is where life & light originated from. It is the basic source of all power and energy.


Thank you for the compliment. Why does it pack more of a punch?

Do you find it easier to work with than the more widely recognised Light aspect of the craft?

Could you expand on ...... dark is where light and life originated from? I know I said that this wasn't my priority but as a matter of interest it is worth taking note of.

I forgotten half of what I wrote up that I wiped, but this will do for now.

As I've said before, I'm trying to build a working knowledge of the Darkness within. I have never used this before, so I don't want to mess it up.

I would be kean on hearing of any experiences you have had working with your inner darkness. Do you have any exercise you use to explore it?

Thats enough for now.

Cheers,

RC


Hi Rc...darkness is a far more intense level of raw energy. Because it is so raw, it tends to pack a "heavier" punch.

I have always had an easier time working with dark than the light. To me, the rawer the energy within it's natural form, the easier it is for me to work with.

Now the remark I made "Dark is where light and life originated from" is from (to me) basic knowledge. Look at a watermelon for example. Studies have proved that the flesh on the inside is black UNTIL you cut it open. THEN it turns what? Red. A lighter shade. Another example is when a woman is carrying a fetus inside of her (or any pregnant mammal for that instance), the womb is what? Dark. Yet life develops. Look at the vas amount of marine life that is hundreds of miles under the deepest seas...totally black...yet...life thrives (also without that form of life thriving in the darkness, us here in the light could not survive...right? Why? Because one needs the other in order to sustain life).

When one enters a dark room. Their mind...their basic (primal) instincts kick in. They become more aware of the air around them. All of their senses become active.

Dark is not bad or negative. It is simply raw matter and energy.

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#17 RavensClaw

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 10:23 AM

Hi Sandy,

Thanks for your honesty, I think maybe I've approached this wrong and instead of focusing on Dark energy, The thread has become two separte things. All will become clear.

Right .. now personally I cannot focus as good in a city as well as I can literally amongst nature with roots that are buried deep into the Earth and is pulsating with energy. To me a cityscape represents destruction and pollution and the energy for me is ALOT different. Maybe it is ME that is different for I cannot stand city life for long..


I'm with you on this Sandy. I find it very hard to live in cities. Too many people, too much noice, not enough space or greenery.

Saying that, cities and towns are natural environments. I appreciate how some people will disagree with this, but to me a city is no different than an ants nest or a bee hive. I see humans as animals, as with all animals being there changes that environment. Granted we've had a more noticeable affect on the face of it, but so have many other species. Saying that, as such we should be able to work with the energies of the environments we live in.

Through history we have acknowledge the spirits of the places we inhabit. The classic example of this would be the Romans with their home shrines dedicated to the Genius Loci of the house. This principle would be easily transefered to modern day and working with such energies.

It was also common for city states to have their own dieties. The Greeks as probably the best example of this with Athens and Athena. These later became national devinities.

Ok I've not exactly answered anything with this but I'm trying to show you where I'm coming from as I've spent sometime pondering over Dark and City related issues.

No, I have never worked with energies from war or pollution and never will. To me this is man made and has not come directly from any natural source of the Universal Energy. I do not put this energy into the same category as darkness, to me, war, crime etc is a man-made manifestation of evil itself from greed and can not be controlled or manipulated..


This again is where we are looking at it from different angels, each of which is equally valid. First I would like to appologies, I have been looking at this from a purely acedemic and conceptual point of view. I did not take time to think of the emotional overtures and connotations attached to these very dark and desturbing aspects of human nature, for this I am sorry and will try to be more aware in the future.

I would be greatful if you could expand on the point you have made about not using energies which have been shaped by man such as war, pollution etc I find this point of view interesting. Where do you draw the line between what is a natural energy source and what is tainted by the darker aspect of man?

I think from an acedemic point of view, I would disagree. War, pollution, deception etc have been the basis for many God/desses. For example Mars god of war, Loki god of tricks and gnerally nasty etc The point I'm trying to argue is that for all our existance we have put human nature on Dieties and nature. Without realising it all I have done is looked on in a completely modern setting. After all how many witches have used such dieties...... have they realy considered what the moral implecation of using say a God of War actually are? The killing, rape, starvation, loss of innocents.

Again I'm not trying to challenge anyone, I'm just trying to stimulate discussion.

Darkness is all around us - some people even assume that necromancy is a form of working with dark energy. We all perceive it differently - you just have to find what stirs the darkness in you and work with it, for my "darkness within" could be entirely different from yours.


This is fantastic and what I was intending to encourage in this thread. Do you have any suggestion of how to find the darkness within? Could you explain further?

I realise that its specific to the individual, but is there a common thread which we all share? If not, why not? I appreciate that we are all different, but we share more in common than we do not incommon (IMO).

Thank you so far for a stimulating if a little ethically disturbing thread.

RC

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#18 Sandy

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 10:45 AM

hehe ok Ill do my best to answer you RC


Saying that, cities and towns are natural environments. I appreciate how some people will disagree with this, but to me a city is no different than an ants nest or a bee hive. I see humans as animals, as with all animals being there changes that environment. Granted we've had a more noticeable affect on the face of it, but so have many other species. Saying that, as such we should be able to work with the energies of the environments we live in.

Yes, of course we all can work with the energies no matter where we are. I was talking about my personal preference of working within a non city environment. I need peace and tranquility around me to focus. I cannot do that with police cars, fire engines and city life noise outside. I find it too distracting I find it very hard to block it out unless I wear earplugs. Then again, the city does have some lovely parks but for me personally it is not the same as feeling as "free" as the open space.

I would be greatful if you could expand on the point you have made about not using energies which have been shaped by man such as war, pollution etc I find this point of view interesting. Where do you draw the line between what is a natural energy source and what is tainted by the darker aspect of man?

Ok being empathic I literally can feel other people's energy around me and it really brings me down if I don't continously protect myself. I think this is my own main problem and why I do not enjoy using energy that have manifested directly from other people. To me, being alone and connecting with pure nature on a very 1 to 1 basis is what works best for me.


I think from an acedemic point of view, I would disagree. War, pollution, deception etc have been the basis for many God/desses. For example Mars god of war, Loki god of tricks and gnerally nasty etc The point I'm trying to argue is that for all our existance we have put human nature on Dieties and nature. Without realising it all I have done is looked on in a completely modern setting. After all how many witches have used such dieties...... have they realy considered what the moral implecation of using say a God of War actually are? The killing, rape, starvation, loss of innocents.

That is good you disagree, it would be a boring old world if we were all the same. As for Gods and Goddesses I do not preach or pray or even acknowledge their existence. I do not need to personify human traits into an energy to understand it. I can feel the energy bubbling in my solar plexus and that is how I know it exists. I do not believe any God rules over anything in particular. It just IS. The more you question it the more confusing it gets and the further away the answers will get. You have to accept it and embrace it. There are bad people in this world, just as there are good people, there are good spirits and bad ones. No God is commanding them.


Again I'm not trying to challenge anyone, I'm just trying to stimulate discussion.

yes I think this is a fabulous discussion - one of the best so far!


This is fantastic and what I was intending to encourage in this thread. Do you have any suggestion of how to find the darkness within? Could you explain further?

OK, for example take anger. You can focus this emotional energy into what you want to acheive just as you would focus love, for example. It is the same, there is no difference in working - you are you just using a different energy source to manifest your desires. For example, to hex or to curse someone you couldn't do it when you have no desire or reason to do so. Take the reason, take the emotion, dash of intent, no guilt and BAM there you have it :)

I realise that its specific to the individual, but is there a common thread which we all share? If not, why not? I appreciate that we are all different, but we share more in common than we do not incommon (IMO).

Thank you so far for a stimulating if a little ethically disturbing thread.

it is disturbing - it is wonderful!

RC


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#19 RavensClaw

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 11:44 AM

I'll have to go away and think on your answers...... there good. A lot of what you said is true for me as well.

For example, I don't follow dieties, it was just a way of showing an opposing point of view.

Going by what you said about using Darkness Within, I've been using it for years but never realised it. Hell I suppose you could even consider the craft as a form of therapy:rolleyes: Great way of getting rid of excess GRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!

Thank you again for your honesty. Personally I find the idea of using war, suffering etc abhorent. But taking personal feelings is a different matter all together. Our experiences make and shape us, why not use this for workings, it makes sense to me.

RC

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#20 Droghon

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Posted 29 June 2007 - 04:29 PM

Glad you found Sandy's response sensible and stimulating. Sorry I didn't respond before, busy with work etc .

Amazing how simple it is really, dark and light are simply two sides of the coin as we've said before. If you can work with one 'polarity' you should be able to work with the other easily .. so long as you don't have any 'guilt' or 'three fold rules' screwing with your mind.

Whatever gets the job in hand done with the least amount of effort is preferable every time.

Good thread, interesting responses.

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