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Divination is good for starting in magic


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#21 Autumn Moon

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Posted 19 September 2015 - 02:22 PM

Bottom line-she wanted control and enjoyed manipulating. If you want the nitty gritty of the story I'd be happy to send you a pm, but I don't want the details in a public forum. Overall, it was a good learning experience in the realm of spirit work!

____

Yes, please do pm me all the details...thanks!

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#22 Nim

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Posted 19 September 2015 - 08:55 PM

I am finding this thread incredibly helpful. I do tend to use tarot decks frequently, but have rarely done it before a spell, mostly because it doesn't occur to me. I think I need to start doing it on a regular basis though. I find divining comes relatively easy to me via tarot, so the idea of getting a more detailed view of the situation before actually doing spellwork is very appealing. And in some ways, this is probably a "no duh" idea for witches who are divination inclined. I have weird blanks in my knowledge, even though I am not a total newb to this work. Probably more of an early intermediate witch? Anyway, thank you for this discussion.
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#23 Belwenda

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 04:40 PM

For me too, divination is about the present; how to interpret and deal with current events. Although, when I'm reading for myself, I am often times directed to a magical solution- when I would not have resorted to that.... yet :crystal-gazing:
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#24 Havilland

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 05:19 PM

There is certainly a time and place for divination. However, I wouldn't liken it to the shooting a gun reference someone wrote out. In the example listed by Anara, divination very much had a place for it. I'd say go with your gut, if you feel like there's more to a story - reach for it. While some of you feel like casting without divination is reckless, I feel like not being able to trust your instinct and spell craft without needing divination is a sign of self doubt. For me personally, if I had to constantly divine or ask my ancestors I wouldn't be sure of my craft. That's me though. I trust myself. If I feel shit needs to be done, I'm going to do it. I don't skip around the street chanting hex's everywhere I go (though it's a lovely mental image), but if some creep comes up to me and tells me what he'd like to do to my backside while I'm holding my kids hand - I'm not going to take a deep breath and divine what's happened in his life to get him there.
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#25 Nim

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 08:31 PM

There is certainly a time and place for divination. However, I wouldn't liken it to the shooting a gun reference someone wrote out. In the example listed by Anara, divination very much had a place for it. I'd say go with your gut, if you feel like there's more to a story - reach for it. While some of you feel like casting without divination is reckless, I feel like not being able to trust your instinct and spell craft without needing divination is a sign of self doubt. For me personally, if I had to constantly divine or ask my ancestors I wouldn't be sure of my craft. That's me though. I trust myself. If I feel shit needs to be done, I'm going to do it. I don't skip around the street chanting hex's everywhere I go (though it's a lovely mental image), but if some creep comes up to me and tells me what he'd like to do to my backside while I'm holding my kids hand - I'm not going to take a deep breath and divine what's happened in his life to get him there.



Very true, Havilland. I for one was thinking in terms of someone who is more of a beginner and getting the hang of things. Also, um, YES to hexing those kinds of creeps. The mental image of him getting hexed is making me smile. :vhappywitch:

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#26 Anara

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 10:36 PM

While some of you feel like casting without divination is reckless, I feel like not being able to trust your instinct and spell craft without needing divination is a sign of self doubt. For me personally, if I had to constantly divine or ask my ancestors I wouldn't be sure of my craft. That's me though. I trust myself. If I feel shit needs to be done, I'm going to do it. I don't skip around the street chanting hex's everywhere I go (though it's a lovely mental image), but if some creep comes up to me and tells me what he'd like to do to my backside while I'm holding my kids hand - I'm not going to take a deep breath and divine what's happened in his life to get him there.


I think you bring up a valid point. I don't divine when I cast a money spell, for example, or when I need to think quickly and cast on the fly. There are also other times as well where I just do it without anything other than my thoughts. I trust myself enough to follow my intuition. My intuition does tell me to use a method of divination first for whatever reason at times though....

Also- I don't think, in my case anyway, that by using divination I am doubting myself. I think I just want to know more about a given situation. That's not doubting myself-that's just a part of my personality and how my own craft is evolving.


edit: also want to add-I personally don't think that casting without divination is "reckless". I do, however, see how it could be very beneficial to someone new to the craft.

Edited by Anara, 20 September 2015 - 10:39 PM.

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"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you will always long to return." ~ Leonardo Da Vinci

#27 Anara

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 10:44 PM

I was getting about 95 percent strike rate with spells when I was doing them,don't bother much now.i would lay in the star position on floor sky clad for for 20 min before doing spell work it makes you feel good as well.



While I am thinking about it, I did want to comment on this part of the OP's post. I also don't meditate "sky clad" nor do I cast "sky clad". I don't meditate in a star position either. Isn't the whole "sky clad" concept a wiccan thing mostly??

For me personally, the only time I'm doing energy work naked is when sex is involved :biggrin:

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"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you will always long to return." ~ Leonardo Da Vinci

#28 Autumn Moon

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Posted 20 September 2015 - 11:01 PM

LOL, me too!
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#29 Aurelian

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 10:53 AM

Just an FYI if you haven't visited them yet...the bone room has finger bones. I know of one other seller that has them, but he sells them as talismans I think, if my memory serves me correctly.

Thanks, Anara! Will Check them out :)

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"The truth about the world, he said, is that anything is possible. Had you not seen it from birth and thereby bled it of its strangeness it would appear to you for what it is, a hat trick in a medicine show, a fevered dream, a trance bepopulate with chimeras having neither analogue nor precedent, an itinerant carnival, a migratory tentshow whose ultimate destination after many a pitch in many a mudded field is unspeakable and calamitous beyond reckoning." - Cormac McCarthy

#30 Tana

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 12:22 PM

While I am thinking about it, I did want to comment on this part of the OP's post. I also don't meditate "sky clad" nor do I cast "sky clad". I don't meditate in a star position either. Isn't the whole "sky clad" concept a wiccan thing mostly??
For me personally, the only time I'm doing energy work naked is when sex is involved :biggrin:




You are right, the concept of 'Skyclad' is essentially Wiccan. It supposedly derives from when Gerald Gardner was creating the Wiccan religion. Old Gerald was a naturist and so he included the concept in his rituals. I have always thought that it would be a sorry-arsed Traditional Witch who couldn't manipulate power through a few layers of clothing!

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#31 demetria

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 10:46 PM

As mentioned above - sure, for some people divination might help open them up, but it's not for everyone.


Reads to me like candleflame was just suggesting divination as a way to do this, for people who aren't sure where to start: "I think it's good to learn..." "just my opinion" etc. Doesn't read to me as "you must learn and do divination before casting spells".

When I was new to witchcraft and learning from other witches, I would start by doing things they suggested, in the way they themselves did it. Eventually, naturally, my practice has changed (and keeps changing). And one of the great things about this forum (that I've seen so far) is that there are lots of different opinions about things, and ways to try stuff.

While I've been reading through the posts here I've kept in mind that the intention is not to point out "one true way" but to offer information and discussion among likeminded witches. I try to give everyone the benefit of that assumption - means we don't all have to include a disclaimer with every post. Makes it a lot easier to see when someone really is making it into "my way or the highway", I think!

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#32 demetria

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Posted 24 September 2015 - 10:49 PM

Divination provides helpful insights into situations and offers perspective about people/things that I may have not have considered before. That helpful insight may alter my plans at times. I realize this is not the way everyone does things, but this is how I do things and it works well for me.


Well said! I especially like the part about things one may not have considered.

I personally don't do divination before most of my workings, but now you've made me thoughtful and I might try it more often.

Edited by demetria, 24 September 2015 - 10:50 PM.

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#33 bewitchingredhead

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:22 AM

You are right, the concept of 'Skyclad' is essentially Wiccan. It supposedly derives from when Gerald Gardner was creating the Wiccan religion. Old Gerald was a naturist and so he included the concept in his rituals. I have always thought that it would be a sorry-arsed Traditional Witch who couldn't manipulate power through a few layers of clothing!


Grrrr... I hate not being able to +1 mods, lol!
But I totally agree w/you!! Not that there's anything wrong w/being naked- but mosquitos fucking love me and I don't particularly like the idea of being bitten anywhere close to my vagina or butt!

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#34 bewitchingredhead

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 05:39 AM

It's not about the future. It's about the present :smile: It's about ensuring that hex you wish to send to someone based on hearsay is actually deserved. It's ensuring your assumptions and theories are correct before pursuing a magical course of action. It's also a very good way of ensuring there aren't defences intact you weren't aware of such as a spirit attachment or protections placed by another over your target. Even if you're not working on a target- is someone watching you? Have you been hexed so subtly you're not aware of it and are now choosing to take a course of magical action which you wouldn't have necessarily before? I could go on and on about the various ways it could be potentially useful to ask before you act.

Really, I would have never considered it a question of doubt. My spell will work, but isn't it better to check if I really want it to ?


I see your points. I'm incredibly psychic, so I never really thought about the whole divining thing prior to some of the examples you mentioned bc I already just "know" if I'm going to do something. I've also never really personally hexed, but the ones who have it coming I know are def warranted. But again, I can certainly see your point of view. I just don't think the pointing the gun blindly was a great analogy. If you're going to cast a spell, you should already have worked through the mundane things, thought things through, planned, etc. That read to me like anyone casting spells w/o diving first is being flippant, dangerous, etc. about magic in general.

I agree w/Aurelian and feel the same way about my casting. But at least I understand now a bit more why you feel it's necessary, so thank you.

_________
Hey...please do include the details!

I don't divine to see if a spell would work, but like others have said, I divine (not always) to see if my assumptions are correct, what obstacles my exist...


That makes a bit more sense to me as I mentioned in my reply above to Pikku.

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I see you're getting your degree in art of the obvious~myself
Without music life would be a mistake~ Friedrich Nietzsche
Immorality: The morality of those who are having a better time~ H.L. Mencken
When nature has work to be done, she creates a genius to do it~ Ralph Waldo Emerson
We cannot teach people anything; we can only help them discover it within themselves~ Galileo

#35 Aria

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 01:48 PM

I wouldn't shoot a gun blindly. I also wouldn't cast without prior divination.

My two cents.


A truth that many of us have learnt the hard way. +1

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#36 razorim

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 03:16 PM

I am not very good at divination of any sort and have never felt that it was a requirement when it comes to doing a spell. Most of my rituals and spells are done in the kitchen while I'm cooking or cleaning. Divination has never played a part in that. That isn't to say that I am not interested in learning the tarot or other forms of divination, but currently my mind tends to connect more when I'm meditating or focusing on my spell intentions. I do see them as two separate things, but I know that isn't how everyone sees it. I think this is really about "to each their own". If divination before casting is something that makes you feel right about what you are doing, then I think that is a good thing. If divination clogs you up and makes you doubt yourself, then I say forego it and just do the spell without the divination. Either way, it's all about intentions and what each individual gains from their workings, in my opinion.
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#37 Aria

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Posted 25 September 2015 - 04:08 PM

I am not very good at divination of any sort and have never felt that it was a requirement when it comes to doing a spell. Most of my rituals and spells are done in the kitchen while I'm cooking or cleaning. Divination has never played a part in that. That isn't to say that I am not interested in learning the tarot or other forms of divination, but currently my mind tends to connect more when I'm meditating or focusing on my spell intentions. I do see them as two separate things, but I know that isn't how everyone sees it. I think this is really about "to each their own". If divination before casting is something that makes you feel right about what you are doing, then I think that is a good thing. If divination clogs you up and makes you doubt yourself, then I say forego it and just do the spell without the divination. Either way, it's all about intentions and what each individual gains from their workings, in my opinion.


I don't think divination is some kind of 'requirement' for spellwork, nor that divination and spellwork are the same thing. I've just learnt through trial and error, that it is often a wise thing to do to have a good tarot spread before moving on with spellwork, especially if you're working on something complicated, or with different parties involved, or that involves deep corners of someone else's soul. Sometimes I do not have time, and sometimes I just work out of the spur of the moment. But there are other times when my magic needs a bit of planning and a careful shot, because it's either very important or messy. Tarot has proved to be a good way to test the water before going in with the artillery.

Said that, that's how I work. I know people who can work spells with great results and have no attitude for divination whatsoever. Personally, practicing divination regularly, I notice that when I do the cards I get into a space which is not very different from the one I'm in when I work spells.

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La strega è un frutto di terra. (M.)

#38 Nikki

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Posted 26 September 2015 - 02:52 AM

Tana ......... :roflhard:
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