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Have you Danced Your Tools?


Guest monsnoleedra

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ugh.

 

Just to be clear, these people 'chose' to be non-members (if those are the ones you speak of), which is different than being banned. And with them, I'm sorry to say' went a lot of solid members who posted good stuff...just saying.

 

 

I was not a part of any of that.  I can only go by what was posted about the situation. 

 

And I agree with that.

 

I don't dance with swords. I have 'real' ones, I learned the mechanics of them, practiced with them a lot, which is how one makes a weapon truly part of oneself (or any tool for that matter), and I use them as they were mean't to be used. No, I don't go chopping heads off. I have nothing against dancing with a weapon if one chooses, but I would rather it remain a weapon, than just a dance tool.

 

 

I don't have a sword - yet.  It's on my bucket list.

 

There are days when chopping off a few heads sounds like a damned fine idea.

 

My knife is not a dance tool.  It is a weapon. 

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There are days when chopping off a few heads sounds like a damned fine idea.

Poppets & knives are quite handy for this... ;)

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Interesting, I bet Miyamoto Musashi would be pleased to know he's not using real swords because he described dancing with them as part of his book of five rings.  Heck I bet most of the groups that used dancing as a descriptor to define sword combat and perfection of those skill sets would be glad to know they didn't really use real swords or weapons. Heck I bet even those who practice Bojutsu would be proud to know they don't use real weapons or practice with them as real weapons.  Sorry myself I have a WWII Japanese enlisted Samurai sword, Katana type blade, a high grade set of short and long Katana blades and at one time a Scottish Claymore.

 

Weapon dances or dancing with ones weapons was quite common and still lingers as a term within many of the associations I am aware of.  And yes in each the weapon is considered a weapon and treated as such but the dance refines the persons skill with the weapon and makes it part of themselves.

 

Just because people equate dance today to some type of movement across a floor doesn't mean it always did or that its the only definition accepted.  But then maybe that's why it seems Miyamote said there are sword fencers and Masters of Strategy.

________

You see, this post is another perfect example of your proselytizing and arrogance. What the hell do you know about what I do, or don't do - virtually nothing. I find your posts to be profoundly ridiculous. I did not say anything about the people you just mentioned.

Between languages, a lot can get mistranslated, misunderstood, etc. I'm using the word 'dance' as in the most accepted English meaning (since we're not speaking Japanese here), and the context as it appears to be used in this thread, i.e.  to move one's feet or body, or both, rhythmically in a pattern of steps, esp. to the accompaniment of music. 

 

It appears, all you want to do is argue and attempt to prove 'that my daddy can beat your daddy', and/or to try and come up with one-betters, which are not btw. I have no desire to argue moot points with you. I try not to swear, so I'll just say - go argue by yourself. 

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Hi Autumn Moon!

 

_________

 

 

 

Just to be clear, these people 'chose' to be non-members (if those are the ones you speak of), which is different than being banned. And with them, I'm sorry to say' went a lot of solid members who posted good stuff...just saying.

 

Yeah, I had mixed feelings, still do. Don't miss the negative stuff, do miss their experiences and input.  And absolutely, this needs to be stressed and this is a FACT, not opinion, not hearsay, not rumor--they were NOT banned! It was a CHOICE they made to leave, Period.  Moving on . . .

 

 

I don't think that seekers with strong personalities get jumped on, but they will be challenged on certain points if warranted, and I see nothing wrong with that.  However, if one comes across as arrogant, and a know it all, then they might get jumped on to a certain extent, by both members and other seekers.

 

Yup, exactly.   Attitude matters.   But also, not only that,  there have been misunderstandings in the past as well---  as you know it is easy for misunderstandings to crop up when all we have to go on is text, and not the benefit of facial expressions and voice.   

 

 

I don't dance with swords. I have 'real' ones, I learned the mechanics of them, practiced with them a lot, which is how one makes a weapon truly part of oneself (or any tool for that matter), and I use them as they were mean't to be used. No, I don't go chopping heads off. I have nothing against dancing with a weapon if one chooses, but I would rather it remain a weapon, than just a dance too 

 

Have we talked swords before?   I have a few as well, tho haven't fenced since college, or done any sword play save a few goofing around sessions with practice swords. ;)  I am as green as green can be, lol 'Least I know which end to hold, lol! 

But lots of stylized sword fighting traditions (that are meant to be ultimately deadly)are very dance-like, don't you think?
Like that Italian tradition that I cannot for the life of me remember what it is called, which uses both rapier and dagger.  It is *amazing* to watch! 

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Guest monsnoleedra

________

You see, this post is another perfect example of your proselytizing and arrogance. What the hell do you know about what I do, or don't do - virtually nothing. I find your posts to be profoundly ridiculous. I did not say anything about the people you just mentioned.

Between languages, a lot can get mistranslated, misunderstood, etc. I'm using the word 'dance' as in the most accepted English meaning (since we're not speaking Japanese here), and the context as it appears to be used in this thread, i.e.  to move one's feet or body, or both, rhythmically in a pattern of steps, esp. to the accompaniment of music. 

 

It appears, all you want to do is argue and attempt to prove 'that my daddy can beat your daddy', and/or to try and come up with one-betters, which are not btw. I have no desire to argue moot points with you. I try not to swear, so I'll just say - go argue by yourself. 

 

 

And what do you know about mine.  I'm not the one who came in talking about "Real" weapons vice dancing and how they are used or implying its not real weapons or treating them as real because you don't like the terminology. .  Sorry arrogance, not hardly.  Sorry I don't speak passive, submissive, docile or any of those other things it seems some people around here desire.  As far as argument, sorry I simply don't accept the limiting definition that will make others feel good about their perspective at the expense of mine.

 

I don't dance with swords. I have 'real' ones, I learned the mechanics of them, practiced with them a lot, which is how one makes a weapon truly part of oneself (or any tool for that matter), and I use them as they were mean't to be used. No, I don't go chopping heads off. I have nothing against dancing with a weapon if one chooses, but I would rather it remain a weapon, than just a dance tool.

 

 

 

Guess it must have been someone else who wrote that.  Oh wait no it was you...........

 

Man, the implied woo woo factor just keeps getting deeper and deeper..Arrogance  yeah right.

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With regard to herbs, lets see one can talk about nuclear weapons and their affects / effects without going into how to make one.  The same applies to your example.  Flying ointments are often spoken off without going into the composition of the ointment itself or the percentages of each herb / substance that a particular practitioner chooses to utilize. 

 

 

 

Exactly!    So we speak of their existence on the public forum, and get into the details and nitty-gritty such as ingredients and amounts in the private forum.   That's an excellent illustration of what we mean!   Stacy DID make this difference  clear -- you may have missed it so here is her quote :    "Some of us use flying ointments with quite dangerous herbs, do you think we should discuss that in the public area open to seekers? Do you think we should discuss the use of herbs like belladonna, datura and henbane in amounts and experiences in a public area?"

 

 

 

. . .     green area I judge based upon what you do where I can see.  Behind the doors I can only extrapolate based upon what I know to occur behind the walls on many other sites and how most often it simply turns into a pat each other on the back and complain.  Seldom anything new for its all the same members with all the same traits  Many times going over all the same things with nothing new added.  Coupled to the suggestion what they are talking about it to dangerous to be spoken of outside covering areas . . .   etc etc etc   . . . .

 

 

Nope.  Fortunately, that is not the case here.

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 Sorry I don't speak passive, submissive, docile or any of those other things it seems some people around here desire.  As far as argument, sorry I simply don't accept the limiting definition that will make others feel good about their perspective at the expense of mine.

 

 

What most people around here expect/desire is common courtesy.  It has nothing to do with being docile or passive.  It is highly necessary on a forum such as this.   And no one expects you to change your perspective to suite theirs.  Autumn Moon was using the commonly agreed upon definition of the word in the English language. In order to communicate, that is usually what we do around here.  Otherwise it can be a real mess real fast.

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Can we quit with the non-productive back-and-forth, please? Not directed at any one individual but as far as I can tell, everyone has had their say about attitude.

 

If you dance your tools, chime in. If you're interested in doing so, ask. But no more sniping comments or I'll lock the thread.

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Guest monsnoleedra

 

With regard to herbs, lets see one can talk about nuclear weapons and their affects / effects without going into how to make one.  The same applies to your example.  Flying ointments are often spoken off without going into the composition of the ointment itself or the percentages of each herb / substance that a particular practitioner chooses to utilize. 

 

 

 

Exactly!    So we speak of their existence on the public forum, and get into the details and nitty-gritty such as ingredients and amounts in the private forum.   That's an excellent illustration of what we mean!   Stacy DID make this difference  clear -- you may have missed it so here is her quote :    "Some of us use flying ointments with quite dangerous herbs, do you think we should discuss that in the public area open to seekers? Do you think we should discuss the use of herbs like belladonna, datura and henbane in amounts and experiences in a public area?"

 

 

 

. . .     green area I judge based upon what you do where I can see.  Behind the doors I can only extrapolate based upon what I know to occur behind the walls on many other sites and how most often it simply turns into a pat each other on the back and complain.  Seldom anything new for its all the same members with all the same traits  Many times going over all the same things with nothing new added.  Coupled to the suggestion what they are talking about it to dangerous to be spoken of outside covering areas . . .   etc etc etc   . . . .

 

 

Nope.  Fortunately, that is not the case here.

 

 

 

If I misread and allowed frustration to color my response I apologize for that is not my intent.  Both to Stacey as the initial poster and to yourself (Lynn) as I admit I am trying to keep frustration and anger from coloring my responses but it is proving difficult.

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Can we quit with the non-productive back-and-forth, please? Not directed at any one individual but as far as I can tell, everyone has had their say about attitude.

 

If you dance your tools, chime in. If you're interested in doing so, ask. But no more sniping comments or I'll lock the thread.

Okey dokey Lady; I need to edit myself more at times too. ;)  

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If I misread and allowed frustration to color my response I apologize for that is not my intent.  Both to Stacey as the initial poster and to yourself (Lynn) as I admit I am trying to keep frustration and anger from coloring my responses but it is proving difficult.

Okay Monsnoleedra. Thank you for that. 

 

You just gotta use that famous military discipline!  ;)    (that is said with a smile, so you know I'm just ribbing you)

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Hi Autumn Moon!

__________

 

Hi Lynn,

 

For sure, there are all types of cultural dances done with swords, but most are for 'show' only, and would fall apart and not cut a darn thing in real use (they are useful though when first learning combative methods, so you don't inflict a serious wound to oneself). The distinction I was making is that 'I' don't dance with the swords I have in order to make them mine, and I then outlined how 'I' do make them mine. These swords are combat ready, and I use them as such in practice or when using them in a working. It is not the dancing aspect that connects the sword to me or makes it an extension of me, but my practice with it that makes it mine. I also said, I find nothing wrong with connecting with a weapon or other tool, if that is what works for you.

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__________

 

Hi Lynn,

 

For sure, there are all types of cultural dances done with swords, but most are for 'show' only, and would fall apart and not cut a darn thing in real use (they are useful though when first learning combative methods, so you don't inflict a serious wound to oneself). The distinction I was making is that 'I' don't dance with the swords I have in order to make them mine, and I then outlined how 'I' do make them mine. These swords are combat ready, and I use them as such in practice or when using them in a working. It is not the dancing aspect that connects the sword to me or makes it an extension of me, but my practice with it that makes it mine. I also said, I find nothing wrong with connecting with a weapon or other tool, if that is what works for you.

But it really wasn't a dance, it was a way of fighting, a form of fighting maybe is the better way to put it?  Like fencing is a way of swordfighting, with specific moves that work for that type of weapon and when in a real fight, the moves are used because they work.  It just is dance-like in the sense that the moves can be graceful--not that in a real fight people are bouncing about all grace, they are trying to survive not look good. So this is taught in swordfighting schools, it's from Italy and its with rapier and dagger.  I tried to find the name of it, but failed miserably and don't have the time right now to look any further.  But it's okay!  It'll pop up eventually.

Right!  Yes I understood what you meant.  :) 

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Guest monsnoleedra

I was told the reason a warrior danced their tools or weapons was because they fought themselves in each battle.  Each dance was training against any and all perceived or conceived attacks that could be employed against them.  No other opponent would ever know their full strengths or the depths of their weaknesses or the depths to which the individual would stoop to win.  The best they could ever hope for would be a draw for to actually beat themselves would be incorporated into their skill set and refined.  To loose would equally be seen as something needed to enhance their own abilities and craft.  In many ways the ultimate test of facing themselves and having to see their true face.  To recognize their character in all its strengths or weaknesses and find that point of balance within.  Not just the physical balance of muscle and agility balanced but also the psychological and perhaps emotional as it deals outside of the psychological.  From a Bushido aspect one reason the warrior craft is almost always balanced against the creative artist regardless of it being painting, poetry / writing / pottery, etc.

 

I know for me when I dance with the sword it brings a clarity of mind and awareness of surroundings.  The snap of a twig as loud as the boom of a cannon.  The breath of a subtle breeze felt as clearly as the hammer fall of a powerful wind.  In many ways to bring the world to a point of standstill within me as I watch and observe movement about me in all directions at once.  To hear the music of blood and heart in the ears, to taste it upon my lips and feel it move through out my body.  In many ways creating a sense of stillness and calm regardless of the situation and seeing it all move in a near state of slow motion.  To live between heart beats and the potential between each heart beat.  A similarity i've shared with many people who were in the service in my opinion and experience.

 

From being in the military not entirely different than dry shooting and practicing with a weapon or skill sets I suppose.  You train to anticipate and respond to external stimulus and not be shocked by it or hesitate before it, well that's what they tell us with all the drills, repetition and constant evaluation and re-evaluation.  I suppose in many ways to not be startled by the unexpected or unknown for you've faced it hundreds of times in mock battle, dry runs, live runs and upon a mental and psychological level over and over.

 

In my opinion movement, action, reaction, though, perception, understanding and awareness all enhanced.  In many ways muscle memory that allows you to respond without having to think about it to a great detail.  IN my opinion as a fighter a critical base to work from.  As a witch / shamanic practitioner utilizing all of my abilities at once and knowing they are there to support or enable me for it is second nature and part and parcel to me in every breath I breath in, every extremity alert and receptive to what happens within the reach of each tool and how mind and body read the field that surrounds me.  Feeding all my senses, whether they be attuned to the physical world about me or the various dimensional plains that also exist or alternate perceptions of reality.

 

Of course that is my usage and reality from dancing with my tools, others may see things differently. 

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  • 1 month later...

I dance with my husband's tool at least 3 or 4 times a week. I don't know that I really "hear" the music of his pumping blood and heart (although I def feel it) bc the other noises he makes are louder. Depending on my mood, I do taste it on my lips  :munch: (which set of lips depends on my mood). I definitely feel it move throughout my entire body though...and then I feel a big "boom" like the one coming out of a cannon and the earth feels completely still.  :happydance:

 

What can I say? I'm a natural redhead. We tend to be a little devilish and naughty   :cauldron: 

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WOOOHooOOOOOOOoo!   ;)  

I dance with my husband's tool at least 3 or 4 times a week. I don't know that I really "hear" the music of his pumping blood and heart (although I def feel it) bc the other noises he makes are louder. Depending on my mood, I do taste it on my lips  :munch: (which set of lips depends on my mood). I definitely feel it move throughout my entire body though...and then I feel a big "boom" like the one coming out of a cannon and the earth feels completely still.  :happydance:

 

What can I say? I'm a natural redhead. We tend to be a little devilish and naughty   :cauldron: 

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BWR, can't wait to see you post on the tapping the bone thread.

 

Where is it? I shall have a look for sure. :wink:

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