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Divination, What Do You Believe?


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#21 Roanna

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 09:26 PM

To me divination gives you an idea as to what will happen if you continue on the path/course you are on. Understanding this insight into the future gives us the chance to change our behaviours and our path and as a consequence the way our lives map out. I have to say if I believed that tarot cards could only show me a future I had no power to change, I'd throw away every pack I own. I'm interested in taking control of my life and would find little value in a divinatory tool that I couldn't use in shaping my own destiny.
Do what you believe to be the right thing and trust yourself.

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#22 Kayt

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 12:03 AM

I definitely use divination as a "guide" to possible outcomes for my future, but the power of the actual outcome is in my hands alone.

I also use divination to gather certain aspects of a present situation or path that I am not seeing (or choosing not to see!). To me, the outcome a divination suggests is malleable and constantly changing, based on the decisions I make every day. The real benefit, for me, is discovering other influences or nuances going on around me that I might have ignored otherwise.


#23 Loreali

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 09:04 PM

I don't believe it's possible to predict exactly what will happen in the future. Everyone makes different choices everyday which reverberate throughout the world and affect everything that happens. So since those choices directly or indirectly affect everything, it's impossible to know the future for sure. But I do believe it is possible to know what could happen in the future given certain circumstances. Which is why I think when it comes to divination you have to be specific without being too specific. No one is ever going to know exactly what will happen, but by asking the right questions you can get a good feel for what could happen if certain actions are taken or certain events come to pass.

#24 Arabella

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Posted 23 February 2013 - 08:53 PM

For me, divination is real because I have real vission on the future. When I was a child my mother teached me to use the pendulum and I learned to read Tarot. But, I belive that all information is in the astral plane, and the seer can see the past, present and the future.
I think that the all people can be seer and you can do exercises, for example Isis Mantra.

I belive it´s possible to predict exactly what will happen because happened to me and I can write the situation.

See soon.

Edited by Arabella, 23 February 2013 - 08:56 PM.


#25 Jevne

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 12:33 AM

For me, divination is real because I have real vission on the future. When I was a child my mother teached me to use the pendulum and I learned to read Tarot. But, I belive that all information is in the astral plane, and the seer can see the past, present and the future.
I think that the all people can be seer and you can do exercises, for example Isis Mantra.

I belive it´s possible to predict exactly what will happen because happened to me and I can write the situation.

See soon.


I do not believe that anyone is questioning the reality of divination, as many here are fairly accomplished seers, who use a lot of different methods for divining the future. Some, like myself, do not believe in the inevitability of the future, meaning that we do not believe that the future is set in stone. We divine the future, seeing that which will occur, if we or the others involved in the situation continue on the same path. But, once we have seen the future, we have a choice to make. Will we continue on that path, accepting what is to come? Or do we change the future by mundane or magical means, make it to our liking? I am to the point, where I barely use divination, because I make the future what I want it to be.


#26 BirdieMcCloud

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 01:23 AM

In my limited experience, divination seems to be something that is Not Applicable to me. Seriously. I've had 'visions' of random mundane moments that later on would sort of come true - I'd hit the point in reality where the vision would start, and then...the vision would not come true. I've long since given up on keeping track of those visions - why bother if they only show the definite NOT-future?

I've also wreaked havoc on the predictions of otherwise pretty reliable and skilled tarot readers and the like. It got to the point where I asked one of my friends to never tell me about the good stuff that would happen if I followed through on her tarot reading's suggestions and trends...and after a while she pulled me aside and said that since I manage to throw a serious wrench into every outcome she'd ever predicted for me -even when I didn't know what I was supposed to expect, so I could hardly thwart it by preknowing!- that I might be better off using tarot readings as therapy for my inner self and past, rather than divinations.

So...I believe that different kinds of divination allow for different views of the future - some methods I honestly believe show the unchangeable future (though probably in unexpected ways), and some I think more fall in the category of predicting current and future trends, which may change at any given point in time.


#27 Jevne

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 01:41 AM

I've also wreaked havoc on the predictions of otherwise pretty reliable and skilled tarot readers and the like. It got to the point where I asked one of my friends to never tell me about the good stuff that would happen if I followed through on her tarot reading's suggestions and trends...and after a while she pulled me aside and said that since I manage to throw a serious wrench into every outcome she'd ever predicted for me


We happen to share this tendency. If I choose, I can make the cards say anything I want them to say, which annoys the hell out of many Tarot card readers. If they are any good at all, they eventually recognize what I am doing. If they are just card "readers", as opposed to actual seers, I can play with them for a good long time, and they are none the wiser. It is mildly entertaining to fuck with people, especially if they are being all mysterious and pontificating about the riches and love in my future. Like I said, I rarely read for myself these days. When I do, it is usually really complicated situations, that benefit from a little additional insight. It is even more rare for me to ask someone to legitimately read Tarot for me. I only do that if I am in serious and terrible trouble, at which time I would only trust a family member or close friend to assist me.


#28 BirdieMcCloud

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 02:03 AM

We happen to share this tendency. If I choose, I can make the cards say anything I want them to say, which annoys the hell out of many Tarot card readers.


I don't mean to do it deliberately! :P I've encountered my share of frauds with lines, but I've also known people who were pretty talented with the tarot. Seriously, one of my friends was really, really accurate when it came to readings, but she only did a small number of them because they wore her out. I sat in on a few of her readings for our mutual friends - dead accurate unless said friends chose to ignore her advice. I can't go into specifics, but she was really good with numbers through the cards - not lottery wins, but dates, numbers of [whatever] were relevant.

And then along comes me and everything we tried in order to work around the N/A field effect resulted in the same results no matter what. Alas...I don't mind the fact that readings go awry - since most of them I think fall into the 'current trends/changeable future' type of reading - but my curiosity wants to know WHY this happens, and if it's possible to change that. (Not sure I want to, to be honest - these days I admittedly get a perverse kick out of it.)


#29 Arabella

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 10:12 AM

In my experience, The seer has to know Tarot card, pendulum but he/she has to have to talent for vision, For me, I concentrate with Tarot and I can see the future or past vision... I read the Tarot card a unknow people and the thigns happened, but so I think that the future you can change... because the future isn´t a book... but in my opinion I belive that there are things what inevitably happened.

I know a lot of people that they read the Tarot and they don´t understand the symbols cards, and the other peoble use tarot for make money... But I think that all people can learn to have vision, you need effort and perseverance. The perfect balance is know symbols and intuition.

For me, Tarot is a path because I find the symbols, kabalah and the other secrets... Tarot is more divination card.

I hope you understand I recently wake up jejeje and my english is very bad... sorry

Edited by Arabella, 24 February 2013 - 10:14 AM.


#30 Roanna

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 10:43 AM

For me, divination is real because I have real vission on the future.

I belive it´s possible to predict exactly what will happen because happened to me and I can write the situation.

See soon.


Can you clarify? Your post reads to me that you believe the future is absolute, preordained and entirely knowable? That's quite an unusual stance to take on divination. You say you believe divination is real because you have a vision of the future. Do you mean by this that you have insight and wisdom into what may happen and what the consequences may be or are you telling me you can predict whether my number 50 bus will be on time tomorrow? I'm interested. Most of the people I know have a similar view on divination to me, that it is a tool for guidance and support and not a guaranteed view of an already established future.

I'm keen to hear more on your position.

Do what you believe to be the right thing and trust yourself.

Witchpathforward My website incorporating "Ask a Witch a Question," my blog and websites of witchy interest.

#31 Arabella

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 10:58 AM

In my opinion, there are many people who have a talent for predicting the future, but that doesn't mean they can see everything that is going to happen, including hen you're going to go to the bathroom. Because if that was the case, that person would turn crazy. In my personal case, I see things related to me but as I said before, the future is not a book... but I also think that some events have to happen, because you need them in order to learn from them. I use the cards to increase the ability that we all have... some people may use them for orientation. I've had cases of visions reading the Tarot that have came true... But thad doesn't mean I know everything that is going to happen to all people I meet.
There are a lot of mantras for increase the intuition. If you want I can write a topic. :thumbsup:

Edit: The Tarot isn´t only for divination, Tarot is more of path to me.

Edited by Arabella, 24 February 2013 - 11:06 AM.


#32 Jevne

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 01:58 PM

In my opinion, there are many people who have a talent for predicting the future, but that doesn't mean they can see everything that is going to happen, including hen you're going to go to the bathroom. Because if that was the case, that person would turn crazy. In my personal case, I see things related to me but as I said before, the future is not a book... but I also think that some events have to happen, because you need them in order to learn from them. I use the cards to increase the ability that we all have... some people may use them for orientation. I've had cases of visions reading the Tarot that have came true... But thad doesn't mean I know everything that is going to happen to all people I meet.
There are a lot of mantras for increase the intuition. If you want I can write a topic. :thumbsup:

Edit: The Tarot isn´t only for divination, Tarot is more of path to me.


The utilization of mantras in the pursuit of increased Tarot-related intuition sounds like an interesting topic. I was not previously aware of any connection between those two subjects, as they seem culturally removed; however, according to a quick search, the connection is not unprecedented. There are a few references, floating around on the Internet. :cool_witch:

Jevne

P.S. Your English seems to be improving, exponentially, as you post. ;) My son has friends in Spain, and their English, while excellent for none native speakers, is sometimes confusing. They are actually more likely to mix up the order of words, than not know the words or give the wrong words. He tells one of his friends that they sound like Master Yoda. LOL!!!


#33 CelticGypsy

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 03:22 PM

There are a lot of mantras for increase the intuition. If you want I can write a topic. :thumbsup:

Edit: The Tarot isn´t only for divination, Tarot is more of path to me.




Hello Arabella,

That would be a wonderful subject, for your first Stand Alone Post. Please consider offering up your thought process and experiances, to share.

Thank you !


Regards,
Gypsy

" The last thing you wanted a Witch to do is get bored and start making her own amusements, because Witches sometimes have erratically famous ideas about what was amusing "

 

Terry Pratchett Legends 1 


#34 Arabella

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 04:48 PM

Jajajaja, I will write the topic. Firts I will write in spanish in my blog then I will translate in english jejejeje I have a friend what he helps with my english. In the school, I studyed french :cool_witch: jejeje

#35 Grymdycche

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 10:42 PM

This seems to be a repeating topic, I know I've posted something just like this before.
Ah, found it.. it was older than I remembered, exactly one year ago this month.
I made some adjustments for 2013 ;)


For what it's worth, my approach is non-Deity based, more akin to Jung's synchronicity. I believe there are, for lack of a better term, certain "flows", of a kind, to time, events, and life; these seem to be guided or influenced by natural "forces", if you will (not necessarily intelligent, sentient ones however) that, to an extent, can shape the outcome of events for a while, much like the way the wind can determine which sideways directions a falling leaf may take as it loftily drifts ultimately down to the ground. We tend to have a good day, or a bad day, or a winning streak, or even a bad week; it is often said, "when it rains, it pours"; often things seem predisposed toward a particular direction, for a time.

I have not, as yet, come up with a completely satisfactory word to describe this force or influence, frustratingly; the best I've come up with is, "force", "flow", current", and "influence', but none of these are really adequate in expressing the concept as I envision it. I'm sure the word is out there, I just have yet to find it.

So, divination, to me, is like wetting your finger and holding it up to see which way the "winds of fate" are blowing. It's the Hermetic principle: As above, So below; that which affects the very large, such as the events of our lives, the macrocosm, will also affect the very small, the microcosm, such as the outcome of a "simple" lay of cards (or casting of runes, etc), as they are subject to the same influences and thus follow the same current pattern. In this way we should get an indication of present and near future tendencies.
Tools of divination are metaphysical windsocks! -or weathervanes, if you prefer.

But, winds are also subject to sudden change, and likewise with these influences that act upon our lives, I believe that long term divination is "iffy" at best, and even short term is no guarantee. It just means what's probable, or likely, but by no means written in stone. And I definitely don't see the mere act of divination itself changing or creating the future, only you can do that (maybe!); that said, it's possible that a reading may motivate you to act in some way you would otherwise not have, thus changing the likely course of events.

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9 out of 10 string theory physicists agree: 'Nothing Rests; Everything Moves; Everything Vibrates'' -the Kybalion.

#36 Jevne

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Posted 24 February 2013 - 11:14 PM

This seems to be a repeating topic, I know I've posted something just like this before.
Ah, found it.. it was older than I remembered, exactly one year ago this month.
I made some adjustments for 2013 :wink:


I don't recall, if I voted your response up the first time you gave it, so I'll do it now. I find this a very plausible explanation with only minor variations from my own understanding and interpretation. Thank you for sharing (again).


#37 Whiterose

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 12:35 AM

This seems to be a repeating topic, I know I've posted something just like this before.
Ah, found it.. it was older than I remembered, exactly one year ago this month.
I made some adjustments for 2013 :wink:


For what it's worth, my approach is non-Deity based, more akin to Jung's synchronicity. I believe there are, for lack of a better term, certain "flows", of a kind, to time, events, and life; these seem to be guided or influenced by natural "forces", if you will (not necessarily intelligent, sentient ones however) that, to an extent, can shape the outcome of events for a while, much like the way the wind can determine which sideways directions a falling leaf may take as it loftily drifts ultimately down to the ground. We tend to have a good day, or a bad day, or a winning streak, or even a bad week; it is often said, "when it rains, it pours"; often things seem predisposed toward a particular direction, for a time.

I have not, as yet, come up with a completely satisfactory word to describe this force or influence, frustratingly; the best I've come up with is, "force", "flow", current", and "influence', but none of these are really adequate in expressing the concept as I envision it. I'm sure the word is out there, I just have yet to find it.

So, divination, to me, is like wetting your finger and holding it up to see which way the "winds of fate" are blowing. It's the Hermetic principle: As above, So below; that which affects the very large, such as the events of our lives, the macrocosm, will also affect the very small, the microcosm, such as the outcome of a "simple" lay of cards (or casting of runes, etc), as they are subject to the same influences and thus follow the same current pattern. In this way we should get an indication of present and near future tendencies.
Tools of divination are metaphysical windsocks! -or weathervanes, if you prefer.

But, winds are also subject to sudden change, and likewise with these influences that act upon our lives, I believe that long term divination is "iffy" at best, and even short term is no guarantee. It just means what's probable, or likely, but by no means written in stone. And I definitely don't see the mere act of divination itself changing or creating the future, only you can do that (maybe!); that said, it's possible that a reading may motivate you to act in some way you would otherwise not have, thus changing the likely course of events.


I agree with this as well. I think I posted in other threads about my recent understanding of the two different main currents, the life/creative current and the death/destruction current and I think divination just lets you know which one is most influential during that time and in what way. Of course there are other little currents or forces that affect things but I see these as the two main ones. This post falls in line with my recent path gnosis so to speak. Voted up as well.


#38 Belwenda

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Posted 25 February 2013 - 03:55 AM

I think divination; and for me that's usually tarot (although I do use runes occasionally ), helps me clarify a present situation . Used in concert with astrology , oracles show me a way to navigate the waters in which I find myself . Also they point to factors that may influence an outcome or factors over which I may effect change.
"For there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so" W.S.

#39 Autumn Moon

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 07:25 PM

I think that A+B = outcome, unless a 'C' is introduced that changes it to a new outcome. However, I think that some things are destined due to the complexity of the situation. I think the witch can do nothing to change that, other than their position in the situation, ie. I imagine there were seers and witches who predicted WW2, but could do nothing magical to prevent it happening. But, they could change their position in it to a certain extent.

#40 Jevne

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Posted 13 April 2013 - 07:37 PM

Autumn Moon:

I can appreciate your assessment of the power of divination. Your comment regarding someone's "position in the situation" is really what it comes down to for me. This is why I say that I am not out to change the whole damn world. I know the size of my sphere of influence and work within those parameters. I don't have a problem with the fact that I do not get premonitions of world catastrophes or divinatory insight into global pain and suffering, because I understand that complexity that you speak of. Being a social creature, I feel for those in need or strife, just like any other human being, but without the direct connection to the people or situation(s), my ability to impact change is limited. That being said, I have been personally called to some issues, but usually not through divinatory means.

Jevne