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Hypnosis and witchraft


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#1 Kanena

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:48 AM

First of all, sorry for my bad English.

As I say in my first post, in a few weeks, I will have to start a new life from scratch in a new country but I will still have to feed my family, so everything must goes smooth. I will have to remove gently but quickly anything that can stop me to reach quickly my main goal: “to feed my family”.

Because of that, I am working for few month how to make someone change his mind using witchcraft. I get great result and like to share what I believe that I understand from this experience.

At first, when I was using spells for this goal, sometime it works, sometime not. When it was working, it looks like the idea to change his mind came from the subject itself.

Then I understand that if the spells is going too far from what is acceptable to do by the subject, I get no result from the spell.

This remember me hypnosis. (I am not a therapist, I practice hypnosis as a hobby).

Hypnosis is a set of 'tools' that allow the hypnotist to 'write' directly in the unconscious mind of someone idea or orders. But it is not possible to directly make someone do something that I will never accept to normally do. (On TV show, the hypnotist never select himself the subjects but ask for voluntaries, the persons that get on the stage know that they will have to do things (sometime stupid things) and they already accepted it, that why it works each time. The hypnotist can understand quickly also if a subject will not accept to 'cooperate' and it will quickly move to the next one).

So how knowledge in hypnosis help me to better practice my craft?

I will tell you first how hypnosis works:

If I give you a direct order : 'Today, you want to drink a lot of coffee'. The reaction of your conscious mind will be to check the sentence and react. You will probably thinks: “Who is this guy that give me orders? I will never accept to obey to him... and so on”. Your answer will be “No, I won't”.

But if the idea is coming from inside you : 'Today, I want to drink a lot of coffee'.
Your conscious mind will believe that the idea is yours and the reaction will be “Yes? Why not?” and you will probably drink more coffee.

The trick of hypnosis is to bypass the filtering of the conscious mind to write directly in the unconscious mind orders or idea, in our example: 'Today, you want to drink a lot of coffee'. So, when the subject will go to drink a coffee, the order will come back from the inside him and will be accepted by the conscious mind.

Here an easy way used in covert hypnosis: “I don't want you to think about it now, but you may want to drink a lot of coffee today, or not”.

What is happening? This is not a direct order but a suggestion where the subject can do it or not, it is not even required to think about it. So the conscious mind will not reject it directly and will pass it to the unconscious mind . But the unconscious mind doesn't work well with negation and possibilities so the so the sentence “you may want to drink a lot of coffee today, or not”, will be understood as “you want to drink a lot of coffee today”, and be 'saved' like that.

Do we got what we want? Not yet!

Here an example: We have 2 subjects:
  • Bob that drink each morning a cup of coffee
  • Jane, that had a near deadly experience from bad coffee in the past, and don't drink anymore coffee.
When our order will come back to Bob from inside him, it will be probably accepted and we will have the reaction we want. In the case of Jane, when the idea will be back to her conscious mind, it will react: “What are you thinking now? It is too dangerous!” and the idea will be rejected.

In hypnosis, a way to over pass the Jane reaction, is to create another reality. For example, during a trance, we will try to convince her that new coffee have no relation from the old one and are absolutely safe. This is only a very basic example, it will be probably more tricky than that to over pass the Jane's problem. But here is the idea.

How this help me in my craft?

Before to cast a spell, I am using my empathy and some trick that I learned (but divination should work also, or even asking) do understand how the subject will react to the spell and find if there is anything that can block it.

Then I add to my spell the words that can first remove what can block the goal of my spell then write the final goal.

It is working like a charm :wink:.

I hope it help!


#2 Whiterose

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 03:18 PM

Interesting concept. I use something similar.

#3 Kanena

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 04:30 PM

@One of Many: Oh yes? Can you give more details?

#4 Whiterose

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 07:03 PM

@One of Many: Oh yes? Can you give more details?


I don't really care to, no. I don't use it in my spells though. Just a more direct, everyday manipulation.


#5 blaquecinder

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 08:32 AM

I love this post right here, I do this in my everyday life before I go into a deep sleep ( that point where your body is all tingly right on the edge of sleep) as a way to mainipulate myself into tomorrows events. Before I go to sleep I tell my conscience self to tell my subconsicience self (while I'm sleep) what I will be doing tomorrow what time to wake and the order in which I do it, and from the time I wake up (alway right around the time i tell my conscience self to tell my subconscience self to get up and get going) to the time I lay it down its all atomatic I don't even have to think about it. Which (for me) conserves my PHYSICAL energy (and I say physical energey because all the things that I decided to do in a conscience state takes more 'physical energy' for example if I consciencely decide today right now that I'm going to deep clean my bathroom I will be more physically drained afterwards vs. if I tell my consicences mind to tell my subconsicences mind that thats what I will be doing tomorrow before I go to sleep the night before. If that makes any sense.) I've never realy thought of this as a form of hypnosis and I definanly never thought about using it in spell crafting but now that you have piqued my interest I am interested in seeing what happens if I did.
"All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost; the old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not reached by the frost." J.R.R. Tolkien

#6 Kanena

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:10 PM

@blaquecinder: Thanks for your interest.

You say: "I'm going to deep clean my bathroom I will be more physically drained afterwards vs. if I tell my consicences mind to tell my subconsicences mind that thats what I will be doing tomorrow before I go to sleep the night before"

As far as I know about hypnosis, you FEEL less physically drained afterward because you don't have to fight with yourself to take the decision and do it, it is coming naturally, from inside you. For me auto-hypnosis works better with per-recorded message instead to learn it and think about it during the trance.

Concerning witchcraft and hypnosis:

1/ Often some abilities are dormant inside us, just because we cannot convince ourself that we can do it. Hypnosis (auto-hypnosis) Is a good way in this case. (Yes, there is always the orther side of the mirror, may be I don't have an ability but because I used hypnosis I now believe that I have it. With hypnosis, we must be carefull).

2/ Events in our life are often produced or modified by human interaction. Understanding how we take decision and how to manipulate them is beautiful. You don't see the life with the same way after (Neither advertising in TV. They use a lot covert hypnosis techniques and they master them).

Here some tips on how to learn hypnosis:
There is a lot of book about hypnosis, there are generally good. Books about social psychology can help a lot also. Books (and youtube video) about covert hypnosis are generally sh*t. Covert hypnosis it is an art very difficult to master well and there is a very few good information about it.

Edited by frayves, 29 December 2012 - 04:28 PM.


#7 blaquecinder

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 07:45 AM

Frayves, I ues that tecnique because of a book I read called 'Mind Programming' by Eldon Taylor. You should check it out really one hellva book (even only if for informational purposed rather than self improvement) , but its not a book about hynosis persay (I guess you could say the general Idea could stem from it) In my mind when I think about they word hyonsis it's as having things suggested to your subconscience in an altered state of mind this book is more about subconscience suggestion in a consicience state of mind (if that makes any sense really good book u should read it) anywho this book is a big part of how I figured out how to inprove myself in certain area through mere suggestion to the subconsicence mind (which again is what I understand hypnosis to be only through an alternate state of mind.)
"All that is gold does not glitter, not all those who wander are lost; the old that is strong does not wither, deep roots are not reached by the frost." J.R.R. Tolkien

#8 Jevne

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 02:56 PM

What are the implications, from a witchcraft perspective, if the target of the spell is not within physical or verbal contact of the caster?

#9 Michele

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 03:18 PM

What are the implications, from a witchcraft perspective, if the target of the spell is not within physical or verbal contact of the caster?


Interesting question, and one I have not decided my personal belief in, as of yet. Can a spell travel down the block? Yes. Two blocks, 10 blocks, a river, an ocean? I do believe proximity is important, but that it also depends on how something is delivered. I believe the wind can deliver a spell farther distances than some other things. I also believe some things can be delivered via the hex-threads or "unseen roads". I do believe that water dissipates, so depending on how one is using it, it may not be the best mode of delivery. I do highly question that "energy" will stay formed-to-will across miles by itself without some way of taking it there other than by pure intent and/or visualization.

M


#10 Whiterose

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 03:51 PM

Interesting question, and one I have not decided my personal belief in, as of yet. Can a spell travel down the block? Yes. Two blocks, 10 blocks, a river, an ocean? I do believe proximity is important, but that it also depends on how something is delivered. I believe the wind can deliver a spell farther distances than some other things. I also believe some things can be delivered via the hex-threads or "unseen roads". I do believe that water dissipates, so depending on how one is using it, it may not be the best mode of delivery. I do highly question that "energy" will stay formed-to-will across miles by itself without some way of taking it there other than by pure intent and/or visualization.

M


Using my method of mental manipulation, it is very much based on proximity and the openness of the recipient, so I would have to agree with you here. It is interesting that certain spells would need different modes of delivery; that it is not a "one size fits all" type thing. I think that is why we see so much variability in the craft as people find better ways of sending their will out in to the universe towards its intended destination. There are so many ways to do something, yet also so many ways to improve that process, granted one understands the concepts and forces that drive whatever it is they are doing.

Edited by Whiterose, 30 December 2012 - 03:52 PM.


#11 Jevne

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 04:01 PM

Interesting question, and one I have not decided my personal belief in, as of yet. Can a spell travel down the block? Yes. Two blocks, 10 blocks, a river, an ocean? I do believe proximity is important, but that it also depends on how something is delivered. I believe the wind can deliver a spell farther distances than some other things. I also believe some things can be delivered via the hex-threads or "unseen roads". I do believe that water dissipates, so depending on how one is using it, it may not be the best mode of delivery. I do highly question that "energy" will stay formed-to-will across miles by itself without some way of taking it there other than by pure intent and/or visualization.

M


Yes, as you and I have at times shared an obvious connection; yet, some part has become lost in the translation of distance. Some workings, such as those involving healing, I find difficult over distance, so I was curious in regard to this discussion.


#12 Kanena

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 05:15 PM

Wow, so many interresting subjects ….

@blaquecinder : Thanks for the suggestion. I know this book ('Mind Programming' by Eldon Taylor) but I never read it because I believed it was bullsh*t. My mistake. Ok, When I will have time, I will buy it

You speak about “subconscience suggestion in a consicience state of mind”. It is also hypnosis, It is used in covert hypnosis mainly. I didn't know that I can do it to myself. I will check it.

@The Exiled Goddess: Do you know about non-locality of quantum physic? Also “The small, the large and the human brain” from Penrose and “Evolution Of The Brain : Creation Of The Self.” from Sir Eccles, (if you didn;t read them yet) explore a very interresting theory that, I beleive, can be connected to withcraft
I will write a post about this fascinating theory (but I don't have time now, sorry).


I don't realy know if distance matter for witchcraft, but concerning my empathy, the distance in kilometers doesn't matter but the distance in time before the last physical contact matter a lot. I believe that we can be interconnected when we are close to a person or to an object (that why we can do witchcraft, because there is a contact, let's say, quantum contact). but may be the connection get weaker with the time.

I general I cannot explain witchcraft by energy traveling our 3D world, if it was like this, someone should have detected it.

My theory is mostly that our 3D world (ok 4D world) is just an artifact and what is going under that as nothing to do with space and distance (and may be nothing to do with time also). I believe also that witchcraft is working (not travelling) in this plane. I beleive also that our brain (See Penrose and Eccles). and may be everything that exist is connected to this plane This could explain also the paradoxes in quantum physic (Ok, quantum physic is not a finished theory and it is easy to place our beliefs in the holes of a theory unfinished).


#13 Michele

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 07:01 PM

... @The Exiled Goddess: Do you know about non-locality of quantum physic? Also “The small, the large and the human brain” from Penrose and “Evolution Of The Brain : Creation Of The Self.” from Sir Eccles, (if you didn;t read them yet) explore a very interresting theory that, I beleive, can be connected to withcraft
I will write a post about this fascinating theory (but I don't have time now, sorry)...


I have mixed emotions about quantum physics within the craft, mostly because I'm not a scientist and not looking to be one, lol. And secondly, because so many people believe that if one can explain how or why something works, then magic doesn't exist. Like it would no longer be a spell, but a scientific "something." For me, it doesn't have to be one or the other, explaining magic or divinity or anything doesn't negate its existence for me. My favourite book on other worlds is still "Horton Hears Who" and sometimes I feel that just going forward on the childlike belief and wonder of things is better... that in explaining them we make them "mundane" and often sadly train ourselves out of experiencing them and are left only with understanding them but not living them :-)

M

Edited by Michele, 30 December 2012 - 07:02 PM.


#14 Jevne

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 10:29 PM

Frayves,

There are already several threads on the Forum, which mention quantum physics, if you are so inclined. I am sorry I am unable to link them for you with my Nook, but a standard search should work. Or perhaps others would be so kind to link some for you.

Best wishes.


#15 Kanena

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 11:18 PM

@Jevne: Thanks a lot, I will check it.

@The Exiled Goddess: You say
- "if one can explain how or why something works". Don't worry, I am sure that the real secret is definitly out of our reach, especialy to scientist,
- "that in explaining them we make them "mundane" and often sadly train ourselves out of experiencing them and are left only with understanding them but not living them" same as before but I beleive that, even if we will never understand the real secret "lying under", some finding in the "logic" that drive this can be usefull to be a better witch.
-"I feel that just going forward on the childlike belief and wonder of things is better": Yes, it is my dream too, but at I this moment what I need most is to be a witch as powerfull as possible, so I need to understand witchcraft as much as I can.

Thanks a lot everybody for this beautiful discussion.

Edited by frayves, 30 December 2012 - 11:22 PM.